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80 points thunderbong | 26 comments | | HN request time: 2.568s | source | bottom
1. lokar ◴[] No.42200889[source]
I see apple as like LVMH, but for phones. It has a minority of overall sales, but a majority of the “luxury” part of the market. This gives them influence over the whole market, but not a real monopoly.
replies(6): >>42200914 #>>42201067 #>>42201094 #>>42201131 #>>42201148 #>>42201290 #
2. echelon ◴[] No.42200914[source]
You have two choices for phone ecosystem, and they're both bastards about what you can put on your device. Google uses the tyranny of defaults, deeply buried settings, and scare walls to accomplish much the same thing that Apple does by strictly being draconian. It's mafia behavior over the most important device category in the world.

Both of these companies need to have their asses handed to them. Not just by the US DOJ, but by every country. What we do with our phones is bigger and more important than two companies that got there first. They'll still have their trillions dollar market caps after the DOJ tells them they must allow web installs.

Apple and Google's only role should be to provide a hermetic sandbox with permissions layer and do occasional malware scans. That's it. Once we buy the devices, they're ours, and these companies should have no say as to what innovation takes place and what customer relationships are built after the initial sales are made.

replies(2): >>42201057 #>>42201440 #
3. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201057[source]
> Google uses the tyranny of defaults, deeply buried settings, and scare walls to accomplish much the same thing that Apple does by strictly being draconian.

Ah yes, Google is so draconian that on Samsung devices Samsung Internet is the default browser and Swiftkey is the default keyboard. And all the settings are incredibly easy to find, you can sideload easily, make any app the default for it's category, etc... They are not close to equivalent.

replies(1): >>42201735 #
4. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201067[source]
It's strange how they've convinced people that, considering there's nothing at all luxurious about their products, not even the price...
replies(1): >>42201442 #
5. sneed_chucker ◴[] No.42201094[source]
iPhones are priced in line with other flagship phones.
6. mattmaroon ◴[] No.42201131[source]
The trial is in the US where Apple does actually have a majority of overall sales.
7. gyomu ◴[] No.42201148[source]
That analogy would only make sense if a Louis Vuitton bag was the same price as a North Face one yet outperformed all the competition when you take it on a 3 month backpacking trip

Except it doesn’t

8. makeitdouble ◴[] No.42201290[source]
This was the old Apple under Jobs.

Tim Cook made it a juggernaut that holds more than half the market in many areas, can buyout whole supplies of a specific technology (e.g. TSMC and their 3nm process?), influences the relationships with a whole country (China) and has the size to weather most battles (e.g. the fight with the EU).

9. arminiusreturns ◴[] No.42201440[source]
I'd be willing to be money that if we knew the truth, it would be that three letter agencies have infilled/influenced the big two and made sure phones will remain controlled, leaky ecosystems of surveillance... ..."for the greater good"/"national security"

That's why DOJ (same DOJ that let Epstein walk because he "belonged to intelligence") won't do any such thing.

10. bobbylarrybobby ◴[] No.42201442[source]
What's luxurious about Apple products is that they tend to respect your time
replies(5): >>42201472 #>>42201662 #>>42202285 #>>42202412 #>>42202452 #
11. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201472{3}[source]
Those are words without much meaning. So, how do you think they "respect" your time more than other smartphones?
replies(1): >>42201663 #
12. makeitdouble ◴[] No.42201662{3}[source]
Does your time feel respected when you're leaving the Kindle app to open a web browser, search for the book that was next in the series, buy it, and get back to your Kindle app to continue reading ?
13. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42201663{4}[source]
> how do you think they "respect" your time more than other smartphones?

I have an iPhone. It just does its job. Updates in the background. Repairs are a peach, especially by mail. They don’t spam me.

replies(1): >>42201717 #
14. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201717{5}[source]
Updates in the background? It's not 2005 anymore... All phones do that. Androids have done that since version 1.0. Just works? Ditto. So the answer is just... vibes?
replies(1): >>42201849 #
15. nar001 ◴[] No.42201735{3}[source]
We're not talking about what manufacturers can do, but about what users can do, they're not the same
replies(1): >>42201772 #
16. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201772{4}[source]
Well only 1 platform lets users do pretty much whatever they want... That's not even up for debate.
replies(1): >>42202191 #
17. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42201849{6}[source]
Partially yes, Android vs iPhone is largely vibes. The point is it’s a product that works for years without the user having to fuck with it too much for most use cases. If the hardware fits your needs, it’s the best in the world. If you like a 3.5mm jack, there are other options—hence why it’s tough to argue they have a smartphone monopoly.

If you’re asking why it’s luxury, it’s a combination of the materials, machining and service experience. Luxury products aren’t necessarily better, certainly not for someone who can’t afford them. They’re simply more luxurious. Easier, more comfortable, et cetera.

replies(1): >>42201905 #
18. dismalaf ◴[] No.42201905{7}[source]
This is the thing though. Non-Apple phones are made of equally nice materials, have equally nice design and equal or more utility. Several Samsung phones and the folding Pixel are more money than the top end iPhone. Hell, because of carrier subsidies the top end iPhone can be had for $0 up front.

So what makes an iPhone more luxurious than say, a Galaxy S24 Ultra, Z Fold 6, Pixel 9 Pro XL or 9 Pro Fold?

replies(1): >>42201913 #
19. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42201913{8}[source]
> Non-Apple phones are made of equally nice materials

The machine quality is totally different.

> what makes an iPhone more luxurious than say, a Galaxy S24 Ultra, Z Fold 6, Pixel 9 Pro XL or 9 Pro Fold

Start with the BOM.

replies(1): >>42202094 #
20. dismalaf ◴[] No.42202094{9}[source]
Lol so it's the logo and marketing. Gotcha.
replies(1): >>42202538 #
21. bmicraft ◴[] No.42202191{5}[source]
Well, except for the Play Integrity API (formerly SafetyNet). As soon as you do anything remotely interesting you can't use NFC payments, your bank or even the McDonalds app anymore.

This notably doesn't even achieve it's supposed goal of keep anything secure from anyone - bypasses are found usually days after it's "fixed". That only leaves the conclusion that Google wants to make it painful so as to discourage anyone from stepping out of line. Because that's the only thing it actually achieves, and it does so remarkably well.

replies(1): >>42202303 #
22. sofixa ◴[] No.42202285{3}[source]
By giving you an endless spinning wheel instead of just telling you what the issue is?

I've had this while trying to install apps on an iPad (you need a payment method if the free app you're downloading has extra paid stuff you could buy from it, but why would they need to tell you that) and with their TV+ service where downloading too many (how much? who knows) things at the same time, like you're about to board a long haul flight, gets them stuck in a loop without downloading.

Another one of my favourites is "A USB device is consuming too much power, try disconnecting and reconnecting it" without any way of identifying which device it is.

23. sofixa ◴[] No.42202303{6}[source]
Remotely interesting you mean root your phone, I presume?

I haven't found the need to root mine, there's plenty of flexibility in unrooted Android. I use the browser (actual browser, with its own engine), password manager, search engine, PWAs, email app, launcher of my choice. I use F-Droid for generic apps (like QR code reader).

24. fragmede ◴[] No.42202412{3}[source]
Of all the things they do, that is not one of them. How long does it take from pressing a folder to showing its contents on iOS? How much faster would all of it be without a fancy fade in/out animation? or shrink to dock, or anything else in the UI that takes longer than it has to because it looks cooler that way.
25. bitsandboots ◴[] No.42202452{3}[source]
Relative to when Microsoft intentionally sabotages user experience, sure, but that's a low bar. I'll agree with you more whenever macOS allows me to open more than 1 calculator window at a time, cut files, stop hijacking bluetooth when the lid is closed, and other productivity killing nuisances that make me question if they ever do user studies.
26. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42202538{10}[source]
I mean yes, that’s a big part of what distinguishes luxury goods. Again, luxury doesn’t mean better.

When I say machine quality, though, I’m referring to their titanium and aluminum. I’ve machined some aluminum and know people who have done titanium. It’s really hard, and they do it well.

What does that add to the user experience? I can’t say it’s anything tangible. But I appreciate it. That’s luxury. It’s orthogonal to utility in many ways.