I'm the Canadian who was detained by ICE for two weeks

If the objective is to scare people off from going to the USA, then they're doing a magnificent job. I've heard other cases of people with green cards being arrested and put in terrible conditions, with absolutely no reason given. This woman was ready to go back home and not enter the US, but instead she was dragged through hell and only released because she was Canadian. All those with different passports get subjected to their own more oppressive and never ending hells, like being deported to a prison camp in Ecuador with no idea when you'd ever be released.

New America is absolutely terrifying.

(The forced labor camp is in El Salvador, not Ecuador).

This whole situation -coupled with the outright bans or obstacles in giving visas to people from several countries- cannot but have unpredictable consequences. For example, right now, I cannot imagine any big academic international conference keep taking place in the US. And if they do, they should get boycotted. US right now is neither accessible nor safe for foreign citizens. And I bet recruiting or holding to highly skilled labour force will start being a problem too.

I wonder why agents in the field, customs, immigration etc, seem so eager to implement these changes.

Objective is to earn as much money as possible without regard for people. Those detention centers and prisons are privately owned.

Rhetorical question, or are you genuinely asking?

Was due to go to meet our new local hires post April. Standard ESTA. No way I'm going now.

Smart immigrants shouldn't migrate to US anymore, period. Not if you have more than just very short-sighted dollar signs on your eyes. Its just plain out stupid thing to do, to be treated worse than garbage. This is how institutionalized xenophobia looks like.

The fact is, I've read very similar articles about how US treats any non-US citizens a decade or two ago. Nothing changed dramatically, people just bring these up now due to current admin. In US, if you are not a citizen, you are subhuman and treated as such, directly by government. Why the fuck would anybody with any amount of dignity cause it upon themselves willingly?

Europe can offer you tons of opportunities and treat you with dignity. Good quality of life and happiness is much easier to achieve, much less stress, your health and education of your kids will be taken care of. Or Australia. Heck, almost any other free place but current US, and many places experience much more actual personal freedom currently.

We can certainly do more than just boycott some nazi ev cars.

> For example, right now, I cannot imagine any big academic international conference keep taking place in the US.

There is a language standards committee meeting that was going to take place in the US that is now not because too many attendees think the US is no longer a safe place to travel to. We're already seeing this damage take place.

> New America is absolutely terrifying.

New? I have advised people to not go to the US ever since they instituted the requirement to provide any and all social media profiles they ever had. Way too many chances for some off-context tweet from a decade or two ago to lead to getting refused at the border by CBP with no recourse.

Additionally, anyone who ever got arrested in their life - and be it a conviction for marijuana smoking as a kid and no matter if you actually got convicted, released or the records expunged/sealed - will either have to lie on their application (which is a bad idea because no one knows if the NSA doesn't have taps on other countries' judiciary systems) or have an additional arbitrary hurdle to pass at the border.

And on top of that you're in a conundrum: you have to book hotels, cars and flights prior to applying for a visa because you need that to prove you're not going to overstay... but if your visa/ESTA application fails, you're out a lot of money for nothing.

It's not just permanent or temporary immigration, tourists have been affected as well for years. But hey, the US seems to be willing to lose thousands of dollars for each tourist they scare off, so if it's worth it for them, I'll gladly spend my money somewhere I feel welcomed instead of like a threat.

All the 45th/47th admin has done is adding even more uncertainty to an already steaming hot pile of dung. At least our government has reacted and updated the hints on travels to the US [1], but shied away for now from issuing an official travel warning.

[1] https://www.spiegel.de/politik/usa-auswaertiges-amt-verschae...

I'm not a psychologist, but I'm pretty sure all police forces should have very strong and active civilian oversight, because they seem to attract (or maybe even nurture) some very aggressive people.

In my country, some police forces have skulls on their uniforms and vehicles. How twisted is that?

Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what?

I mean there's the law or some executive order but there's also leeway in implementing. I am not qualified to judge but it just seems to be some sort of preemptive obedience.

They are "Working Towards the Führer" [1].

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards...

Sensible - meeting new hires counts as "work", which is strictly not included under just the ESTA, so you'd have to decide whether to lie to the border guards about it or risk this treatment.

From the article: "Companies like CoreCivic and GEO Group receive government funding based on the number of people they detain, which is why they lobby for stricter immigration policies. It’s a lucrative business: CoreCivic made over $560m from Ice contracts in a single year. In 2024, GEO Group made more than $763m from Ice contracts."

As a Brit: be careful about bigging up how Europe treats immigrants, because the Mediterranean issue has really upped the brutality of immigration enforcement and has resulted in some countries making it illegal to rescue drowning people.

Sorry, but only modalities are a new thing, not the discretionary part with all disregard to proportion. Already decades ago people (and high profile people) were stopped at the custom and sent back without justification (reconstructed as "apparent dislike") with the first flight.

> Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what?

Yes. It's trivial to tell if you're not a citizen and go through customs.

Thanks, the EU is full and has enough immigrants. Why should EU citizens pay outrageous rents, compete against the whole world with their degrees, get lower wages and have prime property bought up by Chinese and Russian oligarchs?

(This does not mean that people should be treated brutally at the border.)

I get the impression that a lot of school bullies get into law enforcement. they don't have the skills/credentials to do anything else and they have the streak of cruelty that you need to fit in.

Obama deported more people than any president in history.

Among the first questions: are they well trained? Some countries cut corners over expenses...

> Smart immigrants shouldn't migrate to US anymore, period. Not if you have more than just very short-sighted dollar signs on your eyes. Its just plain out stupid thing to do, to be treated worse than garbage. This is how institutionalized xenophobia looks like.

No. The US is still the best place in the world for immigrants. There's no other place in the world (barring maybe Canada) where as many people from as many other countries and ethnicities can feel welcome and a part of society. I have several friends who move to European countries (mostly Germany but also the Netherlands) and they never felt like they belonged, while in the US I feel like everyone else. What's going on right now is a temporary shift in this policy, but hopefully the pendulum will swing back.

Guess I'll die, can't find a country that will take me and my partners

> Why the fuck would anybody with any amount of dignity cause it upon themselves willingly?

Presumably because their home country treats them even worse? At least that's the point of the refugee program.

Nonsense.

Saying that as a European who lived in the US for a few years, now residing in Australia.

You're European - you don't understand what it's like as an immigrant from the third world.

"Just following orders"

One thing I'm keeping an eye on is if Canada eventually updates its travel advisory warning for the United States https://travel.gc.ca/destinations/united-states (Currently still at 'normal precautions')

> Thanks, the EU is full and has enough immigrants

EU is full of old people and not enough children. The population pyramid looks like a bullet:

https://www.populationpyramid.net/europe/2024/

It's not difficult to see where that leads to, if we stop accepting immigrants.

But the civilian oversight voted for the guy who promised mass deportations.

The charges are that they facilitated trafficking by rescuing people that didn't need rescuing:

https://www.euronews.com/2023/06/30/these-people-face-20-yea...

Ironically somewhat corroborated by the photo in the article. What is the solution for Italy and Greece with these massive coast lines and islands? The refugees deliberately lose their passports. If the rescuers dumped them in a random North African country, everything would be fine. But they want to import as many as possible for ideological reasons.

> Presumably because their home country treats them even worse

True or not, the important part of why people emigrate is because they believe it to be better. US has been really good at propaganda for a long time, and many outsiders (used to) believe that the US truly is the land of the free, although all the evidence pointed in the other direction.

I hate this new world and the rise of selfishness.

If the rents go up and a native couple that still remembers the living standards of their parents is forced to raise a family in two rooms, they will not have children. Immigrants used to that situation might.

There are other solutions, e.g. that the wealthy boomers pay with their houses for their retirements or are forced to rent out their huge properties.

The retirement ponzi scheme needs to stop at some point anyway. With automation one might also need fewer workers.

Most importantly, many immigrants receive social security and are not employed.

RIP due process 1776-2025

> People should be afraid to come to America.

Currently, it seems the tactics are scaring people who already arrived and are residents. Is that also a good thing or just unintended consequence of trying to scare away the dangerous outsiders?

Which has now become a political programme ("(We won't do what is right, ) we will do what is in our interest").

Because this has historically worked so well with the War On Drugs and the sheer amount of people America puts into prison, yeah? Weird how no matter how hard we ratchet up draconian enforcement measures it doesn't seem to work.

And in this scenario, we're chasing away tourists, foreign talent and more. But hey, at least those sweet private prisons get their kickback from the layers of corruption.

New America? I beg to differ.

The United States has always been hostile to outsiders—what’s different now is that they’re not even trying to hide it.

As a naturalized Canadian, crossing the U.S. border has always been a frustrating ordeal. Despite holding a valid Canadian passport, I’m routinely subjected to an extra hour of “security” questioning. Maybe I’m just unlucky. Or maybe it’s because I was born in an "undesirable" Middle Eastern country and have brown skin. One time I was detained for 5 hours and were questioned about "Islam" (ironically, I'm a Christian so I couldn't answer their questions).

My belongings are always searched, and I’m treated as less than human by CBP. I suspect that if you’re white, crossing from EU or elsewhere, you were used to an easier time until now.

The gloves are off.

There are multiple simultaneous problems:

- A political unwillingness to reign in private capital that's exacerbating resident housing shortages / rent increases (read: AirBnb)

- An infrastructure underinvestment in building sufficient new housing (or motivating current housing owners to densify)

- An underappreciation (Germany) that one can't switch energy mix at nation-scale without first building replacement capacity

- (Europe at least has far more child-rearing-friendly policies than the US)

But all of that is a "maintain demographic shape AND ___" problem.

Countries with inverted demographic pyramids go financially south very quickly.

At best, there are some extremely hard compromises to make (higher taxes on a smaller working base, or decreased social/retirement benefits).

At worst, there are no solutions to balancing a budget and things spiral out of control quickly.

It's underappreciated that "young immigrant labor is funding the country".

I've never been to the US, because I've been scared of these things, for decades, after reading stories about it. I've traveled to Canada and Mexico multiple times, but one time I made the mistake of having a connecting flight in Florida (first and last time).

As expected, I was interrogated by police-looking people about my motivations, yelled at by some other ones to walk faster and use some machine faster, and almost missed my connecting flight because of the "some questions", even though I never actually intended to enter the US, since I was on my way to Mexico.

Hell just answering a phonecall from HQ would be a risk.

For whatever it's worth, I'm treated this way as a white American. I'm selected for extra screening every single time I reenter the country. Though, I don't think it's ever been longer that 30 minutes or so. I don't know why but some combination of having a beard, being naturally anxious and having traveled to "unusual" countries -- at least by American standards. Crossing the border makes for a guaranteed panic attack and I've let my passport expire. It's a damn shame, too, because it's depriving my kids of invaluable life experiences and has brought my relationship with my spouse (who loves to travel) to the brink on multiple occasions.

It’s not just foreign citizens: it’s anyone who doesn’t look white. If you’re a U.S. citizen maybe you’ll get the privilege of being let go in less than a week.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/immigration/2025/03/14/us-citiz...

Onboard them somewhere safe outside the US? Retreat style.

> What is the solution for Italy and Greece with these massive coast lines and islands?

The solution is to once again enable applying for asylum at the embassies and consulates. Then nobody has to drown.

> If the rescuers dumped them in a random North African country, everything would be fine.

Apart from the many people being killed by random North African country, like what is happening currently with migrants in Libya. That's not fine at all.

> But they want to import as many as possible for ideological reasons.

Humanitarian reasons, not ideological.

I knew a guy in my early 20's, not white, who wanted to be a cop. Once he told me "If I have a bad day, everyone gonna have a bad day." I dont talk to him anymore because he became a cop and turned into a fucking asshole.

Yeah, it’s basically “drained pool politics”. The threat of extrajudicial imprisonment objectively makes the US a less attractive place for business and will hurt us economically. The current administration simply cares more about resegregating the country and will cut off all our noses to spite our faces.

US Border control is always worse than any EU-country (as a white EU-resident I might add). We have lots of umlauts in our names äöå etc. which can seriously mess up you ESTA or travel booking unless you double and triple check :)

But still India had the absolute worst border control I've ever experienced. I probably rather sleep on a cold prison floor a couple of days than having to manually reenter all my information eight times!

The venue I published in before dropping out of my PhD purposefully alternated between the US and international locations for these reasons. (Some folks would complain that Canada "didn't count", which would of course greatly offend the Canadians present.)

One prominent professor was screamed at, nearly tazed, and had their car torn apart because the CBP thought they were homeless, which would be amusing if this senior researcher had not been obviously traumatized by the experience.

I have heard terrible stories from Canadian academics for years through presidencies of "both sides", and I'm glad this story is getting the traction it deserves but we also need to be mindful we did not arrive at this moment overnight.

Isn't it obvious that this has more to do with oligarchs hoarding wealth than it does with "being full" of immigrants? Immigrants are nowhere near numerous enough to be doing the kind of damage you claim, but the extremely wealthy do have a stranglehold on resources.

If your goal is to reduce illegal immigration, a much cheaper way is to heavily fine anyone who employs someone without a valid work permit. For most illegal immigrants the motivation is economic and this would reduce that motivation and bring in money from the fines instead of incurring massive cost from detention and deportation without the negative side effect (?) of deterring tourists and legal immigrants.

(Of course, I think the entire goal is economic foot shooting)

People don't want the responsibility of having kids and raising them properly, so they substitute their posterity for foreigners as a bandaid fix. EU is truly a yikes.

Me too. A lot of people who are widely travelled have told me that the US is the most hostile country to enter so, although there are places and people I would love to visit, I have never been.

She wasn't released because she was Canadian. She was released because it was becoming a PR issue.

Illegal border crossings have dropped to almost zero. The policy is working. Private ICE detention centers don’t get any money if people don’t cross the border illegally.

I wonder why they chose to work for ICE...

As a non american: America can get away with a lot more than this and still be an attractive place to try to move to. SF and many other places offer job opportunities the EU can't, and despite this and much more pain of trying to work there it's still worth it.

> Or maybe it’s because I was born in an "undesirable" Middle Eastern country and have brown skin. One time I was detained for 5 hours and were questioned about "Islam" (ironically, I'm a Christian so I couldn't answer their questions).

Scary levels of prejudice and ignorance there. Prejudice against Muslims and I am guessing not knowing about Middle Eastern Christians exist.

> SF and many other places offer job opportunities the EU can't,

Besides a job that just pays more money, what sort of unique opportunities exists in the US that doesn't exist anywhere in Europe? Genuinely curious, as I can't seem to think of any on my own.

Position of authority and power.

> At a certain point the foreigners will turn America into the country they came from.

You say that like it's a bad thing. OH NOES the US will become more democratic and equitable and less racist and hateful

This administration does not want to reduce illegal immigration. They just want to create fear and headlines. If you wanted to reduce illegal immigration, you have a very easy way of doing it through mandating e-verify.

The "immigration crisis" is silently saving the retirement programs of EU countries. People are xenophobic to the point of willingly engaging in self sabotaging their countries.

ACAB

Technically the "due process" clause is in the 14th Amendment, ratified 1868. ;)

The UK does fine employers, its not sufficient to stop it because people work through dodgy contractors.

The UK also fines landlords which has caused problems for people who look or sound foreign, including some British citizens (especially poor ones who tend not to have passports which are the easiest documents to check).

The best proposal I have heard is to provide a cash reward to illegal immigrants for turning in people who knowingly employ them illegally.

The fact that governments do not try these solutions makes me suspect they want to keep that supply of cheap labour - most illegals here work for well under minimum wage.

A substantial portion of US citizens would not date the beginning of due process back to 1776.

> The only option then is draconian enforcement measures to create a deterrent effect. People should be afraid to come to America.

Aren’t you a first generation immigrant? What if your family would’ve been scared to come to the US?

Those are rhetorical questions, by the way.

Border apprehensions have dropped to historic lows. That does not mean border crossings have dropped to historic lows. I also don't fully trust data coming out of this administration.

Was traveling to the US that fraught before 9/11? I think people forget just how much 9/11 damaged the national psyche which to me honestly explains things like Trump.

London at this point is mostly immigrants from the third world. Huge swaths of Frankfurt and Paris are the same way.

Sure, if you immigrate to a random town (population = 1500) in the French Alps from Africa, I grant that you'll never fit in. But the same goes if you immigrate to a small Iowa farming town (population = 1500) from Ecquador.

> For example, right now, I cannot imagine any big academic international conference keep taking place in the US.

I’m not sure what area you work in, but there are still many in computer science and optimization.

Lots of the best colleges in the world are in USA. That’s not to say some aren’t in the EU, but by numbers USA has Europe thoroughly outclassed.

"nor shall any person ... be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law"

is in the Fifth Amendment.

Judging by the "intellectual purge" that just started, I'm not sure working as a professor at a college (world class or not) is such a great job opportunity. But I'm not close to academia at all, so maybe I'm wrong.

I'm curious: which were the unusual countries?

Police reform as a platform is career suicide in the US, because the blue lobby is huge. Not as big as AARP or AIPAC but it's up there.

Does it mean that Al Qaeda won?

"The bishop's smile, a gilded, hollow thing, hides taxman's greed, and whispers of the king; the knight's sworn oath, a rusted, broken chain, while village elders plot for whispered, selfish gain; no judge's word, nor lord's decree rings true, in thirteen twelve, what's left for us to do?"

Which were already planned. And still, right now increasingly more people cannot go or wont go to them. Let's see after this summer how things are gonna go.

The only option is to pursue draconian “enforcement” on people who enter through ports of entry following the established legal process?

Let’s not kid ourselves here, it’s not nor has it ever been about “illegal” immigration, it’s immigration in general.

It's mutual for Americans going the other way and has been for at least the 20 years plus that I've been regularly visiting Canada.

> Millions of illegal immigrants and putative refugees came over in the last four years

Refugees are good. We do welcome your hurdled masses yearning to be free, after all. People should not be afraid to come to America, and I find the sentiment that they should to be disgusting.

As far as illegal crossings, 4 years is a very odd and politicized way to say that; you don’t care about the millions of crossings that happened in the 4 years before?

Obama deported more people than anyone in history, and Biden deported more than Trump. Deporting “suspected gang members” with no due process is antithetical to the American system. We purport to be a nation of laws and justice.

If you want to decrease illegal crossings then do that - but illegally invoking _war powers_ to perform extraordinary rendition as a deterrent is plainly not the way to do it.

It's important to note that basically all university rankings are massively, massively skewed by the native English speaking countries.

Additionally, lots of UK and US universities have huge endowments which definitely helps.

That's not to say that there aren't great Universities there, but really international students go to the US (and some of the EU) so that they have a better chance of working there post study.

I agree. It seems like the goal is not reducing illegal immigration, but creating fear. This is why they’re coming after lawful residents for things like political speech.

There is absolutely no reason to think illegal border crossings were ever much higher than they are today.

Yeah, it's totally doable for the US to deport all the illegal immigrants. The consequences would most likely be pretty high inflation, but it's totally doable.

While I dislike the UK requirement to have a passport on your first day at work, I understand why it exists.

Germany apparently is already warning trans and non-binary people when travelling to the US: https://www.advocate.com/news/germany-warns-transgender-trav...

Yes, they should be afraid, just like it says at the bottom of the Statue of Liberty.

rayiner, I'm wondering if your bloodline is 100% native american, because otherwise it seems like the person you are afraid of is yourself.

You'll find people of Mexican ethnicity widely represented in ICE, Border Patrol, and other such orgs. People looking in from the outside might find this odd, but it's really quite simple. Getting into the US legally is hard, expensive, time consuming, and oh god - the paperwork. And eventually gaining citizenship makes gaining entry look like the easiest thing ever. So you go through all of this, and then somebody else pays some smugglers (enriching some of the worst of humanity), crosses illegally and now 'Yay - Yo soy Americano, hombre!' How do you think the former is going to feel about the latter?

It's also not just some American or Mexican thing. The same is true in many expat communities (of Americans) around the world. Actually maintaining your visa and other stuff in many places is frequently a massive PITA, expensive, time consuming, and so on. If somebody's there with the claim 'No you see bro, don't you understand I'm just an "undocumented migrant"', he's going to be held in very poor regard by most people there legally.

So even at the most basic level - illegal immigration is deeply unfair to people we want in the country. And that's just one aspect among many. The tales of things gone wrong, or simply of the emotional appeal of somebody trying to make a better life for themselves, can be very appealing - but it's but one dimension of an issue that has affects many, and has many consequences.

In the case of the regular officers who were given ICE powers earlier this year they weren't specifically trained at all.

Many of them didn't, the right to act as ICE was extended beyond the service itself through executive order.

I mean, as US citizen I find my interactions with CBP to be easy but it’s because their options are admit me or arrest me vs German guard who questioned me for 15 minutes if my personal laptop was because I was planning on working. Anytime you are entering a country you have right to be in, it’s generally easier.

Many might say the 19th, which took effect in 1920.

20 years after that poem was affixed to the Statue of Liberty, a new immigration law was passed that practically banned almost all immigration. It was passed, because the American population rejected the immigration policy that that poem represented.

I don't think that 120 years later, bringing up that poem is meant to evoke some kind of universal American spirit. This is not what Americans actually believed back then, and it's not what Americans believe today. That poem has been rejected at the ballot box.

Pre 9/11 we could cross with nothing more than a driver's license, making trips with no reason other than to goof off. I even did the same to Mexico. Passports were for overseas or countries that required visas.

To be clear, this is just unabashed xenophobia; there’s absolutely no basis in fact for what you’re saying.

What makes it hard to investigate the dodgy contractors? I don't fully understand why this is harder than identifying illegal immigrants.

>Europe can offer you tons of opportunities and treat you with dignity. Good quality of life and happiness is much easier to achieve

I was wondering how long it would take for this post to generate comments from the smug "as a European" crowd of people with deluded notions of superiority for the complex European continent.

I detest the screaming orangutan politics of Trump and his hardcore followers but the U.S. as a whole mostly remains a fantastic melting pot destination for immigrants like it's always been. One 4-year presidency (after a largely ineffectual and sometimes laughable previous one) does not have to mold the history or legacy of a country. By that logic, barely a state in Europe would be worth recommending at all given the continent's none too distant history or barbaric mistreatment of immigrants.

Even in modern Europe, no, treatment with dignity is not very guaranteed. The old racism of many European countries is seething just below the surface and if it¿s applied even to other Europeans, you can imagine how it might be felt by immigrants from the many countries that have for decades migrated to the U.S and integrated amazingly well for the most part.

Shitting on the U.S has always been de jure in certain circles, and now more than previously (partly deserved thanks to Trump) but it shouldn't happen at the expense of reality.

The dodgy contractors take a markup for taking the risk away from employers. A lot of them are criminals with connections to people smugglers, are both willing and able to get away with things someone with a more legitimate business would not. They are a layer of plausible deniability.

> Presumably because their home country treats them even worse? At least that's the point of the refugee program.

I personally know multiple non-US citizens who did their PhD at MIT. Most of them faced the requirement to temporarily move to the US as a major but necessary nuisance. I also know others who explicitly opted to skip their MIT application to enroll instead in an European program, with all the hoop jumping required to apply for visas being a major factor.

This was a decade or so ago. I assure you that right now things are not looking at better.

Also, people like you should really try to touch grass and try to learn how things are back in the real world. For a few decades now the US is far from being the top choice. In fact, the US doesn't even feature in the world's top 20 in quality of life, in spite of everything. What exactly do you think is happening?

ICE is often the employer of last resort for wannabe cops who can't get jobs at other agencies due to low IQ, poor physical fitness, criminal history, misconduct, etc.

People would literally rather die impoverished, uncared for, and with no dignity in a failing system than maybe have a few brown people around who casually speak a different language and yet, by the testimony of everyone I've ever asked work ten times harder than any local for literally anything.

Like, it's not a perfect solution, there are growing pains, but an adult someone else paid to give a high school education is an insanely good resource. The US's entire gimmick and history has been getting millions of poor immigrants with different ideas and a shred of hope and putting them to work building our country.

But nononono we definitely didn't do this bullshit already with chinese, japanese, german, italian, irish, african, jewish, polish, etc etc etc people. Don't you know it's utterly impossible for people from another country to ever get along with locals? They definitely don't consider themselves just "American" after three generations very reliably, no that would be too easy!

God forbid people in ten generations have slightly darker skin I guess.

Turkey and India, afaict.

> OH NOES the US will become more democratic and equitable and less racist and hateful

If those countries are “more democratic and equitable and less racist and hateful” then why are people coming here?

What do you think the point is of having immigration laws? It’s to control how many immigrants come in and which ones. If you essentially make all the illegal immigration “legal” then you’ve erased the difference.

I’m 100% Bangladeshi on both sides going back to before anyone knows. I wasn’t even born here.

And yes, of course that’s what I’m afraid of! My family left a country full of people like us to come here. Why would we want millions of others coming behind us to turn here into there?

"One 4-year presidency does not have to mold the history or legacy of a country." What actually happens after 4 years though? Isn't the concern, the supreme court ruling that the president is above the law? So laws like, you can't run for more than 2 terms, you must have a democratic election where everyone gets a vote, basically all laws around elections, no longer need be followed. Or for that matter any other laws. A president could seemingly behave like Hitler and face no justice. Trump won't live forever, but what's to stop him handing over to someone similar? (BTW to your main point, I agree indeed Europe has its major issues too)

> we will do what is in our interest

if that at least was true, but often it is not

The conversation I engaged with was about people who are following the law. You are arguing against a point I never made here.

I’d ask you what the point of having laws is if we are going to detain and deport people outside of the established legal process.

This thread is in response to an individual who came here on a valid work visa.

That is an extremely simplistic view.

> Its just plain out stupid thing to do, to be treated worse than garbage.

My home country and the EU treat me even worse because of the lack of 200k+ USD jobs for my experience level

From the article:

> He claimed I also couldn’t work for a company in the US that made use of hemp – one of the beverage ingredients. He revoked my visa, and told me I could still work for the company from Canada, but if I wanted to return to the US, I would need to reapply.

> I restarted the visa process and returned to the same immigration office at the San Diego border, since they had processed my visa before and I was familiar with it.

This lady is Canadian. She has her visa revoked. Then she goes back to an immigration office on the San Diego border to apply for a visa? Last I checked, no part of the San Diego border is in Canada. So how did she find herself in U.S. custody with a revoked visa?

This does not seem to be a disputed fact that there were a massive increase in the number of border crossings under Biden.

TIL vandalism is speech

Where is this quoted from?

> So how did she find herself in U.S. custody with a revoked visa?

The original officer likely lacked the authority to actually revoke her visa:

https://fam.state.gov/fam/09FAM/09FAM040311.html

9 FAM 403.11-3(B) (U) When You May Not Revoke A Visa (CT:VISA-1463; 02-01-2022)

a. (U) You do not have the authority to revoke a visa based on a suspected ineligibility or based on derogatory information that is insufficient to support an ineligibility finding, other than a revocation based on driving under the influence (DUI). A consular revocation must be based on an actual finding that the individual is ineligible for the visa.

b. (U) Under no circumstances should you revoke a visa when the individual is in the United States, or after the individual has commenced an uninterrupted journey to the United States, other than a revocation based on driving under the influence (DUI). Outside of the DUI exception, revocations of individuals in, or en route to, the United States may only be done by the Department's Visa Office of Screening, Analysis, and Coordination (CA/VO/SAC).

That was my first thought. The goal was fear. Here it is.

I get the isolation the contractors provide but why can't one audit the contractors?

Really sad the sibling comment got flagged to death. I code in English! Everyone should code in English! No more C++, no more language standards committees, no more nonstandard languages!

Excellent summary of how a us-american think

>I was wondering how long it would take for this post to generate comments from the smug "as a European" crowd of people with deluded notions of superiority for the complex European continent.

Dozen of country are better than US, people point that out, us-american get offended lmao, relax, we didn't even started pointing to oceania and Asian as better alternative than US

We should actually call it American, not English! The fact that several centuries ago some people in England spoke this language does not give them rights to call it with their place's name, when AMERICA is NOW so GREAT. I code in American, and AMERICAN is the greatest language of all!

And plus we do not need any standards committee for that, just an executive order.

> The solution is to once again enable applying for asylum at the embassies and consulates. Then nobody has to drown.

So you think if those countries don't accept everyone that wants to enter then it's ok for people to try to enter illegally? That's not how borders work.

> Apart from the many people being killed by random North African country, like what is happening currently with migrants in Libya. That's not fine at all.

They can go to a neighboring country without being "stranded" at sea where they need "rescuing".

> Humanitarian reasons, not ideological.

Humanitarian reasons do not require you to pick up people near the coast of Africa and and instead of taking them back back to where they came from bring them to ports much further away. That's purely ideological. One could even call it treasonous.

That's a real first world problem. Most of the world, including most people in western countries don't earn that much.

Lack of offspring is a direct result of cultural and financial policies that tell people they shouldn't settle down and prevent them from affording it. You can fix that instead of giving up your country's identity.

> People would literally rather die impoverished, uncared for, and with no dignity in a failing system

False equivalence. You don't have to give up your country to fix it.

> than maybe have a few brown people around who casually speak a different language

The state of most larger european cities is already well beyond that, bringing with it tons of problems.

> "work ten times harder than any local for literally anything"

That's literally saying they help companies regress the standard of living that locals have fought for.

Meanwhile overall these economic migrants are a net negative financial impact overall because most of them do not come to work but to benefit from generous social programs that they have never paid into.

It's both. And immigrants help the wealthy class become even richer by providing cheap labor while everyone makes up the rest in social security payments.

A better advice would be to avoid social media. You don't have to broadcast your private life to the world but if you do you need to live with the fact that the world includes border control - and it included them even before they started asking for your accounts explicitly.

> Those are rhetorical questions, by the way.

Why? Because you wouldn't like the answer?

> The solution is to once again enable applying for asylum at the embassies and consulates. Then nobody has to drown. > So you think if those countries don't accept everyone that wants to enter then it's ok for people to try to enter illegally?

Right, so let's unpack this. There is no way to apply for asylum at embassies. It was previously possible, but it's not possible anymore. If you want to apply for asylum, you have to be physically present in the country where you want to apply. Since applying for asylum is legal (it's a guaranteed human right and some countries try to respect at least a subset of human rights, wonder for how long), it is also legal to enter a country for the purpose of applying for asylum, no matter what everyone else says.

> countries don't accept everyone

This is not about accepting anyone. Asylum is a totally different legal concept than migration. Asylum is granted (or not), not accepted. People that are drowning in the Med. sea are applying for asylum, if they survive. For most of them, it will not be granted, but they are exercising their rights. People have a right to apply for asylum, countries have a right to grant or refuse at will.

> They can go to a neighboring country without being "stranded" at sea where they need "rescuing".

Everyone has the right not to be killed. Just a basic respect to other human beings would be welcome at this stage.

> Humanitarian reasons do not require you to pick up people near the coast of Africa...

Yes they do, there are again legal reasons for that. The laws can be changed, but until then it is indeed the only legal thing to do. And also some people don't enjoy seeing other people drowning.

That a) doesn't undo past or even deleted social media profiles. Library of Congress has archived the Twitter firehose for years.

And b) it helps nothing against the host of other issues I raised.

I like that people are starting to realize that their first world countries should not give up their resources and power altruistically

How the plunders are divided domestically is another issue but I’d be damned if my country was altruistic internationally

Who are you talking about because no one mentioned any names here?

Are you making the frequently repeated but always false assertion that immigrants don't pay into social security?

You know who's not paying their fair share into social security in any country? It's the rich, yo! It's the rich! By a wide margin!

To be perfectly clear, I don't care one way or the other about more immigration or less immigration.

What I am saying is that compound interest and the ability to purchase assets is going to continue to draw wealth away from everyone except the ultra wealthy, and immigration policy has effectively nothing to do with that.

Calling on everyone to hate each other is going to prevent us from acting together to solve this problem. We could instead work together, unionize, vote for policies and politicians that won't let the ultra wealthy continue to hoard their gold like dragons.

What country are you even talking about? You seem very determined to tell everyone this is the way the world is, but steadfastly fail to show any evidence.

1312!

After the pandemic it picked up as a result of the pandemic drop off, but it settled.

What vandalism are you referring to? I wasn’t referring to any cases where any kind of property damage occurred.

“They come to US so they have a better chance of working in US” seems like it isn’t a counter point.