Most active commenters
  • leakycap(4)
  • kelnos(4)
  • zer00eyz(3)
  • deadbabe(3)

←back to thread

1245 points mriguy | 37 comments | | HN request time: 1.128s | source | bottom
1. jatins ◴[] No.45306204[source]
While the stated intention is to prevent abuse by consultancies, I think this effectively kills the H1B program. Who will be able to afford this?

Not startups. 100k is like 75% of base comp in most bay area startups

Among BigTech, maybe like ~20 companies will be willing to pay this per employee.

replies(5): >>45306264 #>>45306293 #>>45306327 #>>45306502 #>>45307568 #
2. nine_k ◴[] No.45306264[source]
So startups often bring in H1B employees? What prevents them from hiring the same great people remotely?
replies(3): >>45306491 #>>45306769 #>>45306829 #
3. zer00eyz ◴[] No.45306293[source]
> Not startups. 100k is like 75%

I dont know of a single person here on a visa making less than 150k salary. They get the same stock, bonus and benefits that every one else gets.... it's well over 300k to have that staff member when all is said and done.

You're not adding on 100k a year, you're adding on 100k for a 3-6 year employee.

Even if that works out to 20k a year, it's pocket change in the grand scheme of things.

replies(4): >>45306351 #>>45306362 #>>45306461 #>>45308611 #
4. robofanatic ◴[] No.45306327[source]
>I think this effectively kills the H1B program.

That exactly is Trump’s intention, no?

replies(1): >>45306481 #
5. leakycap ◴[] No.45306351[source]
I don't think there is any reasonable evidence to suggest that most workers here on H1-B visas make more than 150k median salary, much less that they are awarded similar options as other employees.

I'm glad to hear this has been the environment you've worked in, but I don't believe it reflects the majority of skilled workers in the US on H1-B.

replies(2): >>45306516 #>>45306527 #
6. jatins ◴[] No.45306362[source]
> I dont know of a single person here on a visa making less than 150k salary

Don't have data on this but anecdotally the base salary range for most YC startup jobs advertised here is around 150k-200k based on what I see.

You are right that it does amortize if the employee stays long enough.

replies(1): >>45307590 #
7. deadbabe ◴[] No.45306461[source]
If it’s pocket change then why not also pay the domestic employees $20k more a year?
replies(2): >>45306594 #>>45307597 #
8. jpadkins ◴[] No.45306481[source]
No, his campaign pledges stated: 6. Ensure Our Legal Immigration System Puts American Workers First Republicans will prioritize Merit-based immigration, ensuring those admitted to our Country contribute positively to our Society and Economy, and never become a drain on Public Resources. We will end Chain Migration, and put American Workers first! https://rncplatform.donaldjtrump.com/?_gl=1*18i1due*_gcl_au*...

He has been pretty good at sticking to his campaign promises.

replies(2): >>45308513 #>>45309916 #
9. pcl ◴[] No.45306491[source]
Time zones are probably the biggest limiting factor, followed by remoteness. In my experience, it's really hard and pretty slow to onboard a remote worker if you haven't already worked with that person in the past. And at a startup, you don't usually have the luxury of time on your side.
replies(1): >>45306713 #
10. Sevii ◴[] No.45306502[source]
It's not a bad thing if FAANG gets every single H1B visa. There has long been a complaint that FAANG is willing to pay 300k+/head in salaries but instead Cognizant gets the visa and pays 60k/head. If we have a limited visa pool it makes no sense to give visas to low paying employers until FAANG is completely saturated.
11. cyberax ◴[] No.45306516{3}[source]
The H1b salaries are public. And the L4 prevailing wage for software engineers in the Seattle area is $200k.

H1b also only takes into account the actual salary, it completely ignores stock bonuses.

replies(1): >>45307902 #
12. Sevii ◴[] No.45306527{3}[source]
H1-B visas go to more jobs than just software engineers. I totally believe H1Bs in the tech industry (startups, faang) make 150k median.
replies(1): >>45307937 #
13. zer00eyz ◴[] No.45306594{3}[source]
Because the person they are importing is probably brighter than you. If you're talented and smart you come to the US and likely the Bay Area (or west coast) to work in tech. Why? For the same reason that baseball players all end up in the US and Soccer players end up in Europe: they all want to play against, and with the best in the big show.

All the H1B's I have worked with are whip smart, hard working, and in general amazing people. I cant say the same for all my localy sourced colleges. The tragedy of the economics in most of these cases was that they were making the same amount of money as their peers and not more...

In a lot of cases companies are getting a Steff Curry or a Lionel Messi and paying them the average of the rest of the team...

replies(4): >>45306843 #>>45307625 #>>45307738 #>>45307794 #
14. nine_k ◴[] No.45306713{3}[source]
Basically all of South America is in US-friendly timezones. I worked with a few quite bright folks from Argentina, for instance.

I suspect that flying someone from Buenos Aires to SF or NYC for onboarding and then and back would cost significantly less than $100k.

Remote work from Europe is harder in this regard, and from India... would be night shifts only.

replies(1): >>45311816 #
15. ◴[] No.45306769[source]
16. giveita ◴[] No.45306829[source]
If you hire someone in say Australia you would be subject to its fair work act, and its courts. You'd need to sus out the tax situation too.

What if they are a contractor? Well usually the law treats these things like ducks and asks if they quack. If it quacks like employment it is subject to that law.

replies(1): >>45310363 #
17. ApolloFortyNine ◴[] No.45306843{4}[source]
>All the H1B's I have worked with are whip smart, hard working, and in general amazing people. I cant say the same for all my localy sourced colleges.

Anecdotally myself, I've worked with great ones yes, but the majority aren't incredible.

In the tech arms of banks you can see a lot of what I would describe as at best regular software engineers, nothing special.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2025-h1b-visa-middlemen-c...

18. kelnos ◴[] No.45307568[source]
Do startups often hire H-1Bs? I've only worked for a few, but they didn't start hiring H-1Bs until they we're fairly sizeable and had taken on a couple rounds of funding.

Certainly the $100k fee is going to make the application much more expensive (though you can amortize it across 3 or 6 years, right?), but it was already not exactly cheap to deal with the legal costs around H-1B employees.

> Among BigTech, maybe like ~20 companies will be willing to pay this per employee.

I think that's a vast, vast underestimation. Most companies, even not-so-big ones, will continue to pay it. Maybe they'll think twice a bit more for future hires, and try harder to find someone local, which I don't think is a bad thing. Or, of course, this could just represent another factor in downward wage pressure across the board, which is bad.

replies(1): >>45308635 #
19. kelnos ◴[] No.45307590{3}[source]
> it does amortize if the employee stays long enough.

And I expect workers on H-1B change jobs much less frequently than citizens & green card holders (and holders of "safer" visas), since changing jobs on an H-1B involves more risk that can end up with you being required to leave the US.

20. kelnos ◴[] No.45307597{3}[source]
Why would they, if they don't have to? What a strange question...
21. kelnos ◴[] No.45307625{4}[source]
> All the H1B's I have worked with are whip smart, hard working, and in general amazing people.

That's surprising; for me, H-1Bs have run the gamut, with a range of talent and ambition that's pretty similar to the range of talent and ambition I see with US-born workers. And I think this is perhaps the problem: your experience should be the norm, if the H-1 visa program is functioning properly, but I don't think that's the case.

Among my friends who have been on H-1Bs, they tend to be high performers, but that's just selection bias at work.

22. ◴[] No.45307738{4}[source]
23. deadbabe ◴[] No.45307794{4}[source]
If you paid $20k more, you would have the more talented locals applying.
replies(1): >>45308544 #
24. leakycap ◴[] No.45307902{4}[source]
If this is public information, I'd love to know what the median salary is rather than taking your word for it on a specific area I am not familiar with.
replies(1): >>45308669 #
25. leakycap ◴[] No.45307937{4}[source]
Even inside the tech industry, H1-B positions are often paid much lower than others within the company (even before benefits are considered).

$150,000 median yearly salary would mean H1-B positions are taking home 10k a month. I've worked with too many people in these positions to believe they're being paid reasonable wages - unless you have an extremely in-demand skillset, H1-B holders are often treated like indentured servants by huge companies/teams.

26. Rohansi ◴[] No.45308513{3}[source]
I don't see how nearly killing the H1B program goes against that pledge. If anything it sounds like something that they could spin as following this pledge.
27. zer00eyz ◴[] No.45308544{5}[source]
India, China, both home to a billion people.

Mathematically if we collected all the brightest people from both these nations, say the top 5 percent of their population thats 100 million people in that pool to pick from.

The entire population of the US is 350million.

Comp sci went from something people did cause they enjoyed to something they did cause they thought it was a pay day: https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/ocpf0g/oc_...

We ran out of talented, passionate people a long time ago.

There is also a cultural problem in America, one that buisness and staff are afflicted with.

https://www.construction-physics.com/p/no-inventions-no-inno...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=At3256ASxlA (pay attention to Noyce in Japan and the article he wrote... think about intel today, compare it to the above article).

I don't think Noyce's take as a business owner is far removed from the above take from the prospective of staff.

replies(1): >>45312390 #
28. peripitea ◴[] No.45308611[source]
If you listen to the interview Trump & team gave, it's $100k per employee per year.
29. jusgu ◴[] No.45308635[source]
It’s 100k per year not per application. So you won’t be able to amortize across 3-6 years
replies(1): >>45313126 #
30. cyberax ◴[] No.45308669{5}[source]
https://h1bgrader.com/h1b-prevailing-wage/area/seattle-tacom... - filter by "Software". Level 4 is $212202, Level 1 is $117749.

The USCIS uses the BLS data for the prevailing wage. You can also check it on the BLS website if you want.

replies(1): >>45309944 #
31. intermerda ◴[] No.45309916{3}[source]
> He has been pretty good at sticking to his campaign promises.

I wouldn't be too surprised if you genuinely believe that Ukraine war has been over since Jan 20 and that grocery prices are at all time low.

32. leakycap ◴[] No.45309944{6}[source]
Level 4 is also described as "This is the fully competent wage level. It is for anyone who have sufficient experience to plan and do work that requires judgement and do independent evaluation, selection, modification and skills. Usually these roles would have management or supervisory responsibilities."

Do you think that the median "Software" developer being brought over on a H1-B is Level 4? Even if you think a large number of them are L4, do you see the issue with trying to exceed a median salary at 150k if the L1 is 117k and the L4 (management or supervisory) is only 212k ... and we're using data from one of the most expensive corners of the US?

33. vrmiguel ◴[] No.45310363{3}[source]
I find that Employers of Record (EoR) make this a non-issue.

I work for an American startup, remotely from S. America. I'm hired according to the (extensive, and expensive) local labor laws, while my startup likely knows absolutely nothing about the intricacies of how my countries' labor laws work, the EoR just handles everything and sends the employer a bill every month.

34. johnisgood ◴[] No.45311816{4}[source]
> Remote work from Europe is harder in this regard, and from India... would be night shifts only.

I do not mind working all day until I pass out, and I do not mind adjusting my life to a different timezone as long as I get paid enough, and considering that USD > HUF, it is probably a no-brainer.

So yeah, hire me for full remote! Unfortunately traveling is out of the question due to disability.

replies(1): >>45312196 #
35. pcl ◴[] No.45312196{5}[source]
If you put a means of contact into your profile, people here will be able to follow up with you.
36. deadbabe ◴[] No.45312390{6}[source]
So you’re going to pay an extra $100k a year per foreign national just to hire them when a domestic employee would be cheaper and pretty much the same.
37. cryptonector ◴[] No.45313126{3}[source]
But the EO is only good for one year, and anyways it's always subject to change, next week, next year, next President.