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191 points impish9208 | 29 comments | | HN request time: 1.83s | source | bottom
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TuringNYC ◴[] No.45104348[source]
I live in a community full of high-achieving GenZ who did 4-7 AP courses, studied their butts off for the SAT, got into good universities....only to not find any jobs when they graduate with STEM degrees. A dozen neighbors' kids have been asking me for zero-salary jobs just to get experience.
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1. abirch ◴[] No.45104461[source]
Frequently people want experience. The new grads are facing a bleak reality with AI and offshoring.
replies(1): >>45104475 #
2. Espressosaurus ◴[] No.45104463[source]
How many of those jobs are for people with 0 experience?
replies(1): >>45104748 #
3. Nextgrid ◴[] No.45104473[source]
How many of them are real? Some of them have been posting the same position every month.

Out of those that are real, how many of them are completely out of touch with what they're asking for? Whether low salary, unrealistic expectations regarding experience/skills, etc?

Out of those that pass the above filter, how many of them have unrealistic application requirements such as tech tests, etc?

And so on. Hiring is a market for lemons, with scammers on both sides.

4. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45104475[source]
Correct if I'm wrong, but from what I observe, lots of job postings have "new grads ok"
replies(2): >>45104545 #>>45105151 #
5. komali2 ◴[] No.45104478[source]
When we had a role open (also a YC company) we had iirc about 400 applicants, we narrowed down to the 50 that were legal to work in the UK, and then interviewed about 20 of those.

Anyway, if all of those people applied to each of the companies in who's hiring, and got hired, the unemployment rate for this subset of applicants would still be 50%. And this was for a junior role as well.

6. stetrain ◴[] No.45104492[source]
How many of those are true entry level (degree but no relevant job experience yet) and either remote or local to these people?

Even with experience I have found applying to full remote jobs to be difficult these days, they are generally voids that thousands of resumes get submitted to and you'll never even know if yours was looked at.

I've had better luck via networking and recruiters with jobs that are asking for at least occasional in-person visits which means that the city / metro area you live in remains very important to your ability to land a job.

7. illegalsmile ◴[] No.45104495[source]
Search for senior vs junior and you'll see 126 vs 7. Experience.
8. tomrod ◴[] No.45104494[source]
While the Who's Hiring thread does indeed have ~200 roles, the vast majority of individuals face hiring requirements like:

- Must have 10 years experience with ChatGPT and 20 years experience in PyTorch.

- Entry level

- Must be willing to relocate to a red state in the US and work under the table

- Must be willing to take the fall for our mishandling of data

9. abirch ◴[] No.45104545{3}[source]
I only saw 3 jobs mentioning new grad (or recent grad) on https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45093192

  1 "Zigment (https://zigment.ai) | Bangalore / Bengaluru, India | Full-time | ONSITE"

  2 "Rinse | IT Manager / Network Administrator / System Administrator | Hybrid in SF Bay Area, Los Angeles, New York (Brooklyn), Boston, Chicago, Seattle, Washington DC, or Newark. (Primarily remote with some on-site responsibilities.) | Full-time | https://www.rinse.com"

  3 "CVector | Full Stack Software Engineer | USA | REMOTE | Full-time | $75k – $120/yr + 0.3% – 1%"
maybe I missed a few because I'm not a new grad and I'm happy at my current company
replies(1): >>45104624 #
10. elevatortrim ◴[] No.45104598[source]
I think the gap between what the companies looking for and what the individuals has to offer is increasing.

When a company advertises a role, they are increasingly looking for someone who either has done the same exact job in the exact specific niche with proven success for a number of years, or an absolute super star who would excel at anything thrown at them.

Most people are neither, so matches are exceedingly rare.

replies(1): >>45104842 #
11. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45104624{4}[source]
If you go to workatastartup.com and select experience 0-1 years, you'll see, coincidentally with the previous number I wrote, about 200 results. Is there something wrong with them? Genuine question, because I tried applying and never got a response.
12. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45104748[source]
What about internships? Are those people at good universities not doing internships, or do internships not count as experience? Don't companies hire interns?
replies(2): >>45104859 #>>45104861 #
13. WalterBright ◴[] No.45104761[source]
For those who have no experience, one can gain experience while in college:

1. contribute to a significant open source project

2. write some significant work of software

3. design and build your own computer

4. build a robot something

5. work as an intern in industry

6. do work as a research assistant

When I was at Caltech, students did (entirely on their own):

1. built a gas powered helicopter from scratch

2. built a tracked robot with an arm and a manipulator

3. built an electronic synthesizer

4. built a functioning railroad that ran through the dorm

5. many built a single board computer for their own use

6. designed and built the campus radio station

7. one fellow designed, built, and sold custom speakers in the student workshop. After graduating, he turned it into a real business and made a fortune

and so on. In other words, turn yourself into someone useful to a company.

replies(2): >>45104877 #>>45106356 #
14. coliveira ◴[] No.45104842[source]
Yes, companies expectations are off the charts. I only wish these companies will go broke soon, so they learn to hire real people to do real jobs.
15. alistairSH ◴[] No.45104859{3}[source]
Sample of 1... we hire interns across our organization every summer. HR, marketing, engineering, etc. And across our locations (US, India, Mexico). We make full-time offers to a decent number of them (not a majority, but more than a few).

And as a manager, I'd absolutely lean towards a recent graduate with some experience over no experience. My "success rate" for grads who have co-op experience (full-time job, often delays graduation by a semester or year) is the highest. Next would be those that had long-term part-time employment (university IT office, etc). Then basic internships. And last, no experience at all - and the "success rate" on them has been low enough I probably wouldn't chance hiring another one.

16. coliveira ◴[] No.45104861{3}[source]
Companies ask for several years of experience, internships don't count even as one year...
replies(1): >>45104916 #
17. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45104877[source]
You gotta realize that "experience" refers to "professional" or "commercial" experience, i.e. you gain experience by having the status of an employee at a company and having relevant job title.
replies(1): >>45105792 #
18. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45104916{4}[source]
Pro tip: do an internship and round to one year
19. t-3 ◴[] No.45105151{3}[source]
Those postings get flooded with applicants, many of them not new grads. New grads are competing with experienced people just to get a foot in the door. Both of those groups have to compete with an AI-generated flood of grifters and scammers and a AI-driven resume filter judging them on whether they match the AI-generated criteria for getting the AI-generated posting which was created because some middle manager wanted to get his nephew a job.
20. WalterBright ◴[] No.45105792{3}[source]
No, I don't gotta realize that. I'd be impressed by a resume with such accomplishments.
replies(2): >>45105814 #>>45105894 #
21. mathiaspoint ◴[] No.45105814{4}[source]
I think you're right that it did used to work that way but now all the juniors are competing with people like me who have done all of that and also have five years of professional experience at large companies.
replies(1): >>45105935 #
22. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45105894{4}[source]
Being impressed by accomplishments listed in a resume requires actually looking at a resume, which most recruiters don't do ;) And even if they do, and even if the recruiter is impressed, they look for X number of years, not for accomplishments.
23. WalterBright ◴[] No.45105935{5}[source]
I don't know you, so I will speculate that something else is going on. There are a lot of ways to not get hired.

For example, one guy I interviewed spent all his time asking about what benefits he was going to get. He had no interest whatsoever in what he'd be doing, and what the company was doing. No hire.

Unfortunately, such is commonplace. This gives the savvy interviewee an advantage - approach the interview from the employer's point of view. Save your questions about how much vacation you'll get until after the employer has decided to hire you.

replies(2): >>45105976 #>>45106234 #
24. mathiaspoint ◴[] No.45105976{6}[source]
First of all I don't think you should be surprised that pay is the most interesting thing to potential employees? That is the entire reason they're tolerating you. If I just want to work on interesting things you would only get in the way.

Secondly, yeah, I'm not like that. I've got three or so side projects (I guess they're just projects now) I'm actively working on and have been building things with my teens. It doesn't matter anymore socially, like everything else in the US your counterpart just never shows up.

replies(1): >>45111020 #
25. koakuma-chan ◴[] No.45106234{6}[source]
Oh you're a recruiter? I am curious about something, I hope you can share what you think: is it a red flag when the candidate doesn't ask questions during interview? I often don't have questions because I have a good enough idea of the company and of what I will be doing already, so I don't ask that kind of questions, and I also don't ask about benefits because I don't really care. Is this seen as bad?
replies(1): >>45110998 #
26. ThrowawayR2 ◴[] No.45106356[source]
I tend to agree with you more often than not but in this case, that's not very realistic. The caliber of students and the opportunities available at CalTech are head and shoulders above those at the average college with a CS program.
replies(1): >>45111073 #
27. WalterBright ◴[] No.45110998{7}[source]
I'm not a recruiter, but I'm friends with one.

Showing interest in the company is very helpful. Asking questions like how does the company make money, what is their criteria for a successful employee, what does the division you're applying for contribute to the success of the company, what kind of person are they looking for, and so on.

28. WalterBright ◴[] No.45111020{7}[source]
> First of all I don't think you should be surprised that pay is the most interesting thing to potential employees?

That wasn't my point. My point was the candidate should show interest in the company.

After all, if you're buying a car, does the car salesman sell you on the commission he's going to make?

29. WalterBright ◴[] No.45111073{3}[source]
Most colleges have shops and facilities for students to make their own projects. All it takes is interest and get-up-and-go from the students.

BTW, Caltech places emphasis on get-up-and-go in their student selections. I was a marginal candidate, and I found out years later that my projects I worked on in my spare time made the difference. I was always building things in the garage and in the high school shop. (But I didn't tell them about the flame thrower I made from a lawnmower.)