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187 points r721 | 2 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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kvdveer ◴[] No.43599992[source]
As long as a substantial number of christians consider Israel a divine-ordained country, there will not be any repercussions for any crime they commit.

The Bible contains literal instructions for genocide, and many Christians bemoan anci nt Israel for not following those instructions to the letter.

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like_any_other ◴[] No.43600099[source]
Only 8% of Americans have a positive impression of Zionism [1]. Whatever is driving US support for Israel, it's not the will of the people.

[1] Figure 2, "What is your impression of Zionism?", https://www.brookings.edu/articles/how-do-americans-feel-abo...

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nailer ◴[] No.43601716[source]
Herzl’s zionism is simply a belief that Jewish people should buy land and live in their ancestral homeland.

He wasn’t orthodox, didn’t believe God promised anything to anyone, didn’t speak Hebrew, but after the Dreyfuss affair (usual racist fake accusation BS) started to petition Rothschild (he was denied) and then other wealthier Jewish people with more success to start buying sand dunes and swamplands for Jewish families to return to Israel.

Herzl is definitely worth either reading or just studying for HN, the books are short and to the point, they dispel a lot of myths one gets from the media, and starting a country is a fairly ambitious project worth studying for any founder.

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stormfather ◴[] No.43601826[source]
He also said that Jews should only hire other Jews.

If I was a politician that advocated Britain is for the British, and that whites should only hire other whites so that minorities have to leave due to economic pressure, how would you view me?

Or is this wrong?

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nailer ◴[] No.43601963[source]
My own personal beliefs aren’t really relevant to the topic.

To answer the question anyway: Jewish and British and French and Arabs and Ghanaians and Balinese may want to hire their own, but there’s a certain point where the rubber hits the road and you may find someone outside the group with the skills or contacts you need.

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stormfather ◴[] No.43602173{3}[source]
My point is that you're presenting Herzl as if all he wanted was to legally purchase land for a Jewish state. But you left out that he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave. I'm trying to ask if this would color your previously neutral and benign characterization of him.
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nailer ◴[] No.43603168{4}[source]
> he advocated systemic racial discrimination to coerce another group to leave

When? You haven't made that point, only discussed that Herzl said Jewish people should hire other Jewish people, which is common among all groups of people, fairly benign and was almost universal in the past.

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1. stormfather ◴[] No.43604686{5}[source]
That is by definition systemic racial discrimination. This isn't hard to understand.
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2. nailer ◴[] No.43605770[source]
As mentioned in the comment you wrote your reply to, this is incredibly common, was even more common at the time, and it’s not at all clear that the intent was to make others leave - Herzl’s main writings about Arabs living in the area was to make them rich.