←back to thread

577 points mooreds | 4 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
Show context
leshokunin ◴[] No.42176328[source]
The constant Russian interference, combined with the regular escalation from the jets patrolling, and the radar jamming, really needs to be dealt with.

We're stuck between having to do timid actions and full NATO escalation. This feels like constant creep.

replies(9): >>42176387 #>>42176516 #>>42176555 #>>42176659 #>>42176846 #>>42176978 #>>42177068 #>>42177307 #>>42178494 #
JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42176978[source]
> We're stuck between having to do timid actions and full NATO escalation

If only there were someone applying pressure to Russia we could have fight for us!

replies(1): >>42177095 #
PKop ◴[] No.42177095[source]
So sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? What has that accomplished so far?
replies(4): >>42177135 #>>42177149 #>>42177189 #>>42177266 #
marssaxman ◴[] No.42177189[source]
What business is that of ours? It's up to the Ukrainians what they are willing to do in defense of their country.
replies(1): >>42177221 #
PKop ◴[] No.42177221[source]
>we could have fight for us

C'mon. Their funding is entirely US dependent. What business is that of ours? We are enabling it. How could you possibly ask the question "what business is that of ours"? Explain yourself, that question is absurd.

replies(2): >>42177245 #>>42179733 #
JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42177245[source]
> What business is that of ours? We are enabling it.

They clearly want to fight! This is like arguing giving someone chemo is enabling their cancer.

replies(2): >>42177278 #>>42180700 #
1. PKop ◴[] No.42177278[source]
Who is "they" and what is "clearly"? They are running out of men they can find to fight, and for quite a while the government and military used very aggressive methods to force men into service. There is a huge desertion problem, in the military and the country itself. A whole lot of Ukrainians do not want to fight.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/ukraine-running-out-s...

replies(3): >>42177314 #>>42177876 #>>42190724 #
2. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.42177314[source]
> Who is "they" and what is "clearly"?

Who do you think?

> A whole lot of Ukrainians do not want to fight

Yes, there is not unanimous agreement on a big political question. Shocking. By this measure, nobody should ever fight for everything.

3. aguaviva ◴[] No.42177876[source]
A whole lot of Ukrainians do not want to fight.

A whole lot of people don't want to fight in any war.

What matters is the relative portion. Though they my differ in the views as to whether the lost regions can be regained, or on what terms a cease-fire may be acceptable -- by all indications, a very solid majority of the society in non-occupied Ukraine supports the fight.

Who is "they" and what is "clearly"?

About 60-80 percent of the population. "Clearly" as in according to reliable polling data I can pull up later. Or by spending any amount of time talking to Ukrainians.

There is a huge desertion problem,

It is obviously a significant problem, but a better source is needed on the "huge" part. The link you provided does not support that view.

If I hear "desertion is a huge problem", what comes to mind it the situation in Afghanstan after the notorious Trump-Biden pullout. The situation in Ukraine is nothing like that, not even remotely.

4. immibis ◴[] No.42190724[source]
I guess you're right. Ukraine should let Russia exterminate the Ukrainians. 3 times as many people will die as died in the German extermination regime, but it's worth it to avoid conscription, right?