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The Impact of Jungle Music in 90s Video Game Development

(pikuma.com)
695 points atan2 | 55 comments | 13 Nov 24 18:43 UTC | HN request time: 0.892s | source | bottom
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louthy ◴[13 Nov 24 20:16 UTC] No.42129500[source]▶
If anyone's interested and wants to hear more, I have a mix of 92/93 era Jungle [1]

Some rough mixes here and there (especially the first one) because it was live from a NYE event. But it suits the style of music, that era was so raw and fresh, the future was being invented right there! Very happy days :)

1) DJ SS - Intro

2) Higher Sense - Cold Fresh Air

3) Deep Blue - The Helicopter Tune

4) Roni Size - Time Stretch (93 Mix)

5) DMS & The Boneman X - Sweet Vibrations

6) Engineers Without Fears - Spiritual Aura

7) Omni Trio - Soul Promenade

8) Codename John - Kindred

9) Brainkillers - Screwface

10) Dubtronix - Fantasy (Remix)

11) M-Beat - Incredible

12) DJ Rap - Your Mind (Gimp/Steve Mix)

13) Asend & Ultravibe - What Kind Of World

14) LTJ Bukem – Horizons

15) Bruck Wild - Silent Dub

[1] https://on.soundcloud.com/WjQVyJRfYMyQLP3f8

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dylan604 ◴[13 Nov 24 21:17 UTC] No.42130087[source]▶
> that era was so raw and fresh, the future was being invented right there! Very happy days

I've been told by several Gen-Z that they've never been to a "rave", and I feel sorry for them. In my town, we had quite the underground scene, but then times changed and it is so much smaller now. Now, "kids" just call it all EDM instead of the specific genre that we know and love.

replies(7): >>42130256 #>>42130886 #>>42131345 #>>42131939 #>>42133602 #>>42134442 #>>42136239 #
1. louthy ◴[13 Nov 24 21:35 UTC] No.42130256[source]▶
There's still plenty of fresh underground music and the 'kids' are doing just fine. Yeah there's loads of mainstream garbage out there, but there always was. The main difference is that this stuff was being invented, whereas most electronic music now is derived from those early 90s invented genres, but even saying that there's still plenty of creativity.

There's a night in London called Cartulis (which is usually at Fold), when I go there it feels very much like the early rave scene to me (this is just one example, of course). I think there's a tendency when we get older to not be as exposed to the bubbling undercurrent of music, so it's easy to just say "it's not as good as it used to be", but that would be a mistake imho. It's there if you look for it.

replies(5): >>42130623 #>>42130734 #>>42131229 #>>42132830 #>>42135343 #
2. dylan604 ◴[13 Nov 24 22:07 UTC] No.42130623[source]▶
I didn't intend someone taking away from that no fresh music was being made. I simply said that the parties of old are no longer happening, so that experience isn't available to them.

I'm constantly listening to new music, and I've come up with lots of new tracks that will make a helluva set list, one day. Problem I have is only owning 1200s, and none of the gear to let those drive digital files. My discretionary funds for gear has evolved into other things so buying the right equipment gets pushed lower on the priority list

replies(5): >>42131530 #>>42132075 #>>42132835 #>>42133300 #>>42134855 #
3. pfannkuchen ◴[13 Nov 24 22:15 UTC] No.42130734[source]▶
Was it being invented or discovered?

I feel like with each new wave of music technology, people basically search the space for a while until the fruitful sub spaces are identified.

The novelty of the exploration is what is there the first time and not there in the future. You don’t know what’s going to sound good until someone happens to bump into it. You get surprises.

replies(1): >>42131017 #
4. dylan604 ◴[13 Nov 24 22:42 UTC] No.42131017[source]▶
hey, you got your drum-n-bass in my trance!

no, you got your trance in my drum-n-bass.

that new wave of technology meant that anyone with access to warez could create music for $0 instead of the thousands on buying synths and samplers. no more renting a truck to haul that gear to a gig; now it's just a laptop and/or tablet. new choons level achieved

5. CuriouslyC ◴[13 Nov 24 23:07 UTC] No.42131229[source]▶
I'm interested in a lot of subculture music, and it really isn't there like it was for the most part. Most families of music seem to have stagnated or regressed. The early 90s gangster rap is definitely superior to mumble rap/emo rap, the 90s IDM/jungle/trance is superior to modern EDM/house/trap and the pop mainstream now is just garbage compared to the the mainstream from the late 80s/90s.

Mixing and production are worlds better and musicianship has improved compared to where it was for genres where people care about musicianship, but the actual music is mostly either painfully derivative or actively worse because it's trying too hard to be "different."

Modern metal is amazing compared to the stuff from the 90s though.

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6. dylan604 ◴[13 Nov 24 23:47 UTC] No.42131513[source]▶
> Mixing and production are worlds better

Long gone are the days of "shoes in the dryer" mixes where guys were just slamming two DATs together with no pitch control. Sadly, I think we've gotten to the point of those tight mixes being less of the skill of the DJ and the result of software. With everything being done on laptops with cool software, I really wonder how many DJs are even mixing and just performing while a premixed file plays.

But as you say, the production quality has definitely improved. The music is just clean with no quality loss from layering/multi-tracking/bouncing. The concept of the space between notes has never been so distinguished.

replies(2): >>42133148 #>>42135960 #
7. stanleykm ◴[13 Nov 24 23:49 UTC] No.42131530[source]▶
is serato no longer a thing?
replies(1): >>42131581 #
8. dylan604 ◴[13 Nov 24 23:55 UTC] No.42131581{3}[source]▶
It is. You want to give me your or buy me one? ;-) I never said it wasn't a thing, only that my discretionary fund for such things prevents me for purchasing them.
replies(1): >>42134409 #
9. hyggetrold ◴[14 Nov 24 00:13 UTC] No.42131716[source]▶
> Modern metal is amazing compared to the stuff from the 90s though.

I know what you mean but Metallica, Pantera, and Emperor (black metal) are still all-time classic staples in my discography.

replies(1): >>42139559 #
10. jorvi ◴[14 Nov 24 01:01 UTC] No.42132028[source]▶
I agree with you as far as Hip-Hop quality goes (assuming that "gangster" encompasses things like Old School East Coast, G-Funk, etc). There was a beauty in how limited the production assets of Hip-Hop were in those days, which fostered a very special kind of creativity. Not to mention how it intermixed with the afro-zeitgeist of that time.

But for example techno and house these days have such a gargantuan amount of variety. And because those genres were digital-ish to begin with, they didn't suffer as much from the evolution of DAWs compared to some other genres.

This would have done well at a 90s rave (especially from 4:45 onward): https://open.spotify.com/track/5v2NmAWURnM260nd2acPLr

I guess for "90s" Metal it strongly varies how much studio backing there was and if it is early or late 90s. Late 90s sounds great: https://open.spotify.com/track/0JBQnLKfLXmlkquabLtAgd?

Three related playlist:

- Very underground 90s Hip-Hop cuts: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1LhtrTYYMKu8G33paRWFIL

- Rave-y Techno: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/7ktoUGruqYdoY3vLhDDtaB

- All sorts of Metal with melodic elements: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1Wec2pdudcDyIHvOu4fL7b

11. stackghost ◴[14 Nov 24 01:08 UTC] No.42132075[source]▶
Ehhh, raves are definitely still a thing in Vancouver at least
replies(2): >>42132259 #>>42133837 #
12. steezeburger ◴[14 Nov 24 01:22 UTC] No.42132166[source]▶
I don't agree. There are so many niche genres now that have never existed before, e.g. vaporwave, phonk, outrun, twee, etc. Gotta dig deeper. There is tons of fresh and original underground music being made still.
replies(2): >>42132710 #>>42134608 #
13. MivLives ◴[14 Nov 24 01:39 UTC] No.42132259{3}[source]▶
PNW in general. Seattle is for sure active. They're not even that hard to find if you go looking for them.
replies(2): >>42133238 #>>42136452 #
14. miek ◴[14 Nov 24 03:02 UTC] No.42132710{3}[source]▶
+1 for phonk, for easy access there are some great playlists on spotify, just search phonk
15. miek ◴[14 Nov 24 03:20 UTC] No.42132830[source]▶
Given when/where you were, you might be familiar with Global Underground. I was excited to learn recently that they relaunched in the past couple years www.globalunderground.co.uk
replies(1): >>42135377 #
16. Blahah ◴[14 Nov 24 03:21 UTC] No.42132835[source]▶
Rave culture is alive and well in the UK - free parties several days a week around Bristol and south Wales. Old heads and the younguns collaborating usually.
17. wileydragonfly ◴[14 Nov 24 04:22 UTC] No.42133148{3}[source]▶
99.99999% of DJs have been performing a premade mix since iPods have become popular. The knob twiddling DJs are hilarious. Ukraine, oddly, seems to be pumping out tons of attractive women dancing off beat behind setups that aren’t even powered on half the time on YouTube. I enjoy the mixes in the background while working and occasionally watch some footage for the laughs. Shake it if you’ve got it.
replies(2): >>42134789 #>>42135381 #
18. WaxProlix ◴[14 Nov 24 04:48 UTC] No.42133238{4}[source]▶
I've not found that to be the case, though I'm only casually interested these days (too old to feel comfortable at most events, worried I'm more there to relive the good old days than a 'genuine' interest etc).

With dB festival gone, do people just hit up showbox or monkey loft shows and try to make friends?

replies(1): >>42133582 #
19. Gud ◴[14 Nov 24 05:03 UTC] No.42133300[source]▶
You are simply disconnected. The rave scene is thriving.
20. MivLives ◴[14 Nov 24 06:20 UTC] No.42133582{5}[source]▶
19hz has a good listing of events. A lot of it is announced on Instagram or Telegram (or the old classic of looking at the fliers on the telephone poles of cap hill). Renegades still happen (the bridge has been a super popular spot) but that season is sorta over. I more favor the Kremwork (that's more my scene) or digital hardcore shows which seem to just pop up everywhere.
replies(1): >>42136854 #
21. jamal-kumar ◴[14 Nov 24 07:24 UTC] No.42133837{3}[source]▶
I can second Vancouver, and will raise you any big city in the USA - most of Latin America as well. Only thing that changes as usual is regionally based music tastes, though I find that people actually dance a hell of a lot more outside the anglosphere

Europe is a given but I hear Asia is popping off too. I have friends in Oceania who do some work around the scene. Really it's all over the world, people never stopped partying it just goes a little more underground here and there

replies(1): >>42136288 #
22. lewispollard ◴[14 Nov 24 09:17 UTC] No.42134409{4}[source]▶
Serato Lite is free (as in beer) and you just need to buy a pair of timecoded vinyl records, which are pretty cheap.
23. dbspin ◴[14 Nov 24 09:54 UTC] No.42134608{3}[source]▶
As a fan of both, I have to admit vaporwave and twee are both dead genres - although vaporwave has spawned a host of successor stuff, the great innovation there all happened a decade and more ago. Twee will always exist, but it's hardly a great example of a lively scene.
24. rorytbyrne ◴[14 Nov 24 10:03 UTC] No.42134661[source]▶
> the 90s IDM/jungle/trance is superior to modern EDM/house/trap

This is your own fault for going to EDM/house/trap parties. Go to better parties, then you'll find better music.

replies(1): >>42135388 #
25. Nursie ◴[14 Nov 24 10:09 UTC] No.42134689[source]▶
> Modern metal is amazing compared to the stuff from the 90s though.

Eh, I've still got a lot of time for 80s/early 90s thrash. Megadeth mostly, it must be said.

replies(1): >>42135055 #
26. magic123_ ◴[14 Nov 24 10:24 UTC] No.42134789{4}[source]▶
As always, it depends on what style you're talking about. For mainstream EDM? Sure I won't fight your figure. But for underground techno (among many others), you're delusional if you think the majority of djs play pre-recorded mixes.
replies(1): >>42143992 #
27. Nursie ◴[14 Nov 24 10:34 UTC] No.42134855[source]▶
Probably depends where you are.

Here in Western Australia there still seems to be a “Bush Doof” party scene. I’m way to old to know the details of that though.

28. a57721 ◴[14 Nov 24 11:05 UTC] No.42135055{3}[source]▶
I still enjoy the trve kvlt black metal like Darkthrone, Burzum, Mayhem, so it's mostly the early 90s for me.
29. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 11:53 UTC] No.42135336[source]▶
Tell me you're out of the loop without telling me you're out of the loop. As someone in my mid 20s, techno music is booming and it has zero EDM/house/trap influences. Everyone my age thinks EDM is cringe, it was a trend of 10 years ago. Go to actually underground sound clubs if you know where they are. I'm guessing you don't, because you're showing how ignorant you are of the scene. Some recently released tracks I picked up as a young techno DJ just in the last few weeks/months:

https://soundcloud.com/kmyle/kmyle-empire-bns089?si=0ce480e4...

https://soundcloud.com/kmyle/kmyle-cocoon-original-mix?si=73...

https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-introversion-sea-...

https://soundcloud.com/regalmusic/regal-undisputed?si=a6bdf3...

https://soundcloud.com/darko-esser/darko-esser-zondag-2008?s...

https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-wtchcrft-new-frie...

https://soundcloud.com/hate_music/premiere-marco-bailey-trai...

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30. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 11:54 UTC] No.42135343[source]▶
Fold is the place to be
31. PrismCrystal ◴[14 Nov 24 12:00 UTC] No.42135377[source]▶
Global Underground never entirely went away. However, the famous label run by the “Boxed brothers” ran into severe financial difficulties in the early millennium. Since then, I have assumed that Global Underground is a mere brand that any prog-ish DJ can pay money to use, to aid in promotion.
32. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 12:02 UTC] No.42135388{3}[source]▶
Fr. Don't know why you're getting downvoted. The bitter people in this comment section who think electronic music died in the 90s clearly wouldn't know a good club if it slapped them in the face and it shows.
replies(1): >>42136433 #
33. MrScruff ◴[14 Nov 24 13:27 UTC] No.42135960{3}[source]▶
Honestly as someone that learnt to mix many years ago on vinyl, the technical skill required to do this well doesn't translate into a better experience for the people dancing. It's not a rock concert with a performer, there's no need to look at the DJ anyway. I care infinitely more about the DJs creative sensibility than their beatmatching skill.
34. PawgerZ ◴[14 Nov 24 14:14 UTC] No.42136288{4}[source]▶
>I can second Vancouver, and will raise you any big city in the USA

I'll reraise you any decent size college town in the US as well.

Heck, I'm in Iowa and there's plenty of raves in the middle of nowhere here.

replies(1): >>42138309 #
35. CuriouslyC ◴[14 Nov 24 14:31 UTC] No.42136433{4}[source]▶
I go to burns/festivals, that's what's typically on offer, don't blame me for society's lack of taste.

I enjoy Berlin minimal techno but it's not exactly popular.

replies(1): >>42136808 #
36. wintermutestwin ◴[14 Nov 24 14:33 UTC] No.42136452{4}[source]▶
This comment would have be so useful to me if you could have at minimum dropped some breadcrumbs.

As an oldster who has only recently gotten into edm, I am clue free on where to begin finding anything underground and mainstream venues suck.

replies(1): >>42152504 #
37. CuriouslyC ◴[14 Nov 24 14:40 UTC] No.42136512{3}[source]▶
I was listening to minimal techno before you were born friend (check out drumcode/derrick may). I go to festivals and you will never hear it.
replies(1): >>42136747 #
38. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 15:00 UTC] No.42136747{4}[source]▶
Bro talks to me like I don't know what Drumcode is. The biggest titan in techno music to the point that people literally call it "business techno" because it's so oversaturated. Yeah I know drumcode. I know who Derrick May is, I don't know what sort of thumb-sucking 14 year old you think you're talking to. Derrick May is not by any stretch of the imagination a purely minimal techno artist. He literally made Strings of Life which is one of the least fucking minimal things I've ever heard.

You're right, minimal techno is not the most popular form of techno right now. That's not a new thing that happened in this decade though. Techno has been going through trends of being faster and more maximalist vs slower and minimalist since it began. I'm sorry that you're struggling to find minimal techno nights to your liking, I'm sure there are some out there and I'm sure the trend will come back around. But the techno of my generation is not all EDM or trap influenced so I know you're talking out your ass. You may have been to many techno events in your life, but what you're saying here just proves you're out of the loop like many nostalgic oldheads. So maybe just take a step back and consider that you may have lost touch with the underground. You certainly have if you think drumcode is an underground reference these days.

replies(1): >>42136789 #
39. CuriouslyC ◴[14 Nov 24 15:03 UTC] No.42136789{5}[source]▶
I can tell you're an angry person. You should try punching a bag instead of raging at people online.

If I have to go to a club in new york or berlin to hear music it's not culturally relevant. The stuff you linked gets zero play at festivals.

replies(1): >>42136828 #
40. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 15:04 UTC] No.42136808{5}[source]▶
Again. Going to a festival does not mean you're going to a good one. Most of the best music happens in clubs in the underground circuit anyway not at "burns", which sounds like the most gentrified, millenial techbro yuppie garbage I've ever heard and I'm unsurprised you're not finding the bleeding edge of underground rave music there.

The key word is GOOD. Not that you just go places bro. You're clearly unsatisfied with the music you're hearing at these events. SO FIND BETTER ONES.

replies(1): >>42149280 #
41. helboi4 ◴[14 Nov 24 15:05 UTC] No.42136828{6}[source]▶
When you're condescending and make bad faith arguments, people will find you frustrating. I'm not sure why you want to emulate your grandparents by dismissing younger people's creativity just like they did to you. Open your mind a bit and try not to become the people you hated.

Edit: Festivals have never been the beating heart of the techno scene my friend. I'm sorry to break it to you. And again, I've been to good festivals which do play this stuff - you clearly don't know where to go and you're taking it out on my generation when its on YOU.

replies(1): >>42138675 #
42. WaxProlix ◴[14 Nov 24 15:07 UTC] No.42136854{6}[source]▶
Awesome stuff thanks, as to kremwork I wasn't aware they'd survived little marias closing - glad to hear some culture is left in the city. Funny to hear of it via HN but hey small world.
43. jamal-kumar ◴[14 Nov 24 17:07 UTC] No.42138309{5}[source]▶
Those are the best places these days. It sucks when clubs get closed in urban areas but there's still plenty of parties happening where you're bothering nobody, and nobody will bother you.

I think I'm at the age where I'm more interested in participating as someone actually creating part of the entertainment if I'm going to feel like I'm having the best time though, I think that's probably the best way for anyone to get into it. Lots of volunteer opportunities at festivals and of course paid gigs you can do. If you're a programmer, maybe getting deep into visuals is a way you can have some fun contributing too.

There are raves happening in warzones and even places you think there would be authoritarian crackdowns like China

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp2qB9qXJ1w

44. Tsiklon ◴[14 Nov 24 17:08 UTC] No.42138333[source]▶
I miss the days of the regional scenes in music. These seem to be long past us now.

Using metal as an example; the 80’s and 90’s as an example had several distinct vibrant scenes, Bergen’s Black Metal, Gothenburg’s Melodeath, Tampa Bay’s Death Metal, as examples. All distinct and vibrant with a period of sustained development with a cluster of artists who seemed to circulate and work off each other.

Today it feels easier to connect with others globally with music genres we like, but it’s almost as if this homogenises the art we produce in a sense.

A core collection of 20-40 artists and musicians working and operating in isolation (comparative to now), sharing what they enjoy, spinning it and innovating it to something new.

To genericise it and bring it back to the core of this place - In a sense one relate these scenes in a way to areas with a particularly strong start-up scene, albeit more freeform and wholly artistic in their endeavours.

45. CamperBob2 ◴[14 Nov 24 17:31 UTC] No.42138675{7}[source]▶
This thread is an artform in itself. Anthropology students will dig it up a thousand years from now and walk away with inadequately-paying degrees.
replies(1): >>42159682 #
46. ahartmetz ◴[14 Nov 24 18:39 UTC] No.42139559{3}[source]▶
May not be your favorite, but Blind Guardian's 90s material is seriously good, too.
replies(1): >>42141679 #
47. hyggetrold ◴[14 Nov 24 22:00 UTC] No.42141679{4}[source]▶
I'm down with Blind Guardian, they're fun!
48. wileydragonfly ◴[15 Nov 24 04:32 UTC] No.42143988{5}[source]▶
Would love to hear the names of your unicorns…
replies(1): >>42145445 #
49. wileydragonfly ◴[15 Nov 24 04:33 UTC] No.42143992{5}[source]▶
Ok, let’s see some links..
50. helboi4 ◴[15 Nov 24 10:02 UTC] No.42145445{6}[source]▶
I'm not going spend my time collating links to help you when you say it like that. They're not unicorns. Nobody in the techno scene plays pre recorded sets and women are no more liable to do it than men. I'm sorry that you're uninformed and sexist. Maybe change your attitude a bit and we can talk.
51. soylentcola ◴[15 Nov 24 18:01 UTC] No.42149280{6}[source]▶
To be fair, regional burns are basically Burning Man without the techbro yuppie contingent. A lot more randos, hippies, and weirdos. More like summer camp for grownups than a place to show off on IG or whatever people use these days.

*(Caveat, haven't been to one in the last 5 or 6 years so things may have changed. As always, "it was better next year!")

52. ikr678 ◴[15 Nov 24 23:30 UTC] No.42152504{5}[source]▶
Follow artist socials, they will promote themselves at gigs. Search for your town name + edm genre on soundcloud, that may tell you the names of regular festivals,events and club nights from the set names. Follow said venue's socials, or regularly check their website for upcoming events.

Figure out who your local promoters are, & follow their socials also.

Go to a youth focused cafe or skate park, look at what event posters are being posted on the walls? Unsure if the kiddies still post bills for small events, honestly everything is on social media these days, and is where you should start once you've identified some names.

In my city, facebook is the most reliable way to discover events - we have very active promoters in the main '$city $genre scene' public fb groups.

replies(1): >>42166915 #
53. henjodottech ◴[16 Nov 24 21:54 UTC] No.42159682{8}[source]▶
I’m taking notes
54. MivLives ◴[17 Nov 24 20:27 UTC] No.42166915{6}[source]▶
In Seattle at least they do posters. Mostly in Cap Hill (the gay area). The super small stuff is generally social only but anything with an actual venue will pop up. 19hz is also a good resource, it's searchable and city specific.
55. AI_beffr ◴[17 Nov 24 23:08 UTC] No.42168172{3}[source]▶
you need to relax dude