Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

I recently moved from the US to Berlin. I plan to return to the US.

Pros of Berlin:

- Good transport

- Bikeable

- Safe

- Cheaper than the big coastal cities in the US, with lower rent.

- Good clubbing (not my thing)

Cons of Berlin:

- Healthcare is inconvenient. Doctor's offices won't pick up the phone, and won't leave you on hold. You just have to go in person. Providers all work in small doctor-owned practices, and you get a referral runaround with huge wait times.

- The food in Germany is terrible. The quality of produce and other ingredients is very bad, and the restaurants are nothing special. One notable bright spot is the availability of vegetarian and vegan food. Also falafel and doner.

- The salaries are shockingly low. Really ask yourself if all the comforts of Europe are worth cutting your salary in 2 or 3, and that's before...

- Taxes. The top tax rate here is in the low-40s, comparable to the US, but unlike the US, the top tax bracket starts below $65k.

- Europe has an impending demographic crisis, and the social safety net they fund by plundering your paycheck probably won't be there for you when you retire.

- Stores in general suck. They have fewer, and worse products.

- Everyone still smokes here.

> The salaries are shockingly low. Really ask yourself if all the comforts of Europe are worth cutting your salary in 2 or 3, and that's before...

Exactly! No amount of health-care and vacation can cover for that. And that's why as for a skilled immigrant, USA is top destination.

> Taxes. The top tax rate here is in the low-40s, comparable to the US, but unlike the US, the top tax bracket starts below $65k.

It's funny when I see Americans on reddit complaining about how they have to pay so much in taxes. When you show them exact numbers, then they start talking about how they don't get "worth" of their taxes.

Salary is very much Berlin specific, for a lot of jobs you will be able to earn around 30% more in places like Munich, Frankfurt or Hamburg. Berlin and the rest of eastern Germany is historically on a lower salary level. Which was fine while real-estate was also significant cheaper in Berlin, that's pretty much gone.

- Everyone still smokes here.

Indeed. I complained about this elsewhere, but on the other hand I probably would smoke like a chimney if I lived in Berlin.

> The food in Germany is terrible. The quality of produce and other ingredients is very bad

Don't shop at Lidl then. Restaurants are what you make of it, goes from basic to fancy and the basic ones are, well, basic. (Though the basic ones are probably at a step lower than the ones in the US because of fast-food in the US)

Though I'll give it to you that 80% of restaurants are generic Italian or Asian ones

> Stores in general suck. They have fewer, and worse products.

Again, don't shop at Lidl. "Fewer products" oh you mean, slightly different products pretending they're not 50% HFCS like in the US? Or products that "look better" but aren't? (like excessively red apples that taste like nothing)

How safe is US compared to EU?, you can get shot in US literally anywhere. Doubt anyone doesn't have a gun there. It's true you make a lot more money there but every day is a Russian roulette.

Government revenue is 30% of GDP. Most of that comes either from taxing either US nationals or those residing inside US, or indirectly via tariffs and inflation (both of which effects both US nationals and foreigners).

90 years ago it was about 1/4th that figure (as percent GDP). We've had an explosion of government siphoning of GDP, so it's no surprise some people aren't happy about the situation. Recent stimulus checks excepted, in the US a single person making above poverty line can actually be taxed into poverty.

I have looked into opting out of social security, but unfortunately you have to be a member of one of a few select religious organizations or certain unusual employment situations to be exempted (believe some teachers and rail workers with special retirement plans are excepted). I would like to see that option. Let me opt out for life of getting benefits of transfer payment, and in exchange not require me to pay any social transfer payment tax.

Nowhere did the OP say they shopped at Lidl. You seemed to have put those words in their mouth, not once but twice. You seemed to have taken the OP's comment very personally for some reason.

Berlin has many wonderful things going for it but Berlin is not known as being some bastion of great food. Nor is known as a food destination. There's a reason for that.

>"Restaurants are what you make of it, goes from basic to fancy and the basic ones are, well, basic."

What does that even mean? Some of the best restaurants in places like NYC, Austin and LA are "basic" restaurants but the food is delicious and cheap. From noodles, pizza, bbq, burgers, tacos, etc.

You comment about apples is really bizarre. The US has some of the best produce in the world, from local farmer's markets to giant Whole Foods. You can also find organic produce at nearly every market these days.

> Berlin is not known as being some bastion of great food. Nor is known as a food destination. There's a reason for that.

It is the 5th city with the most Michelin Restaurants in Europe and 13th in the world https://www.godsavethepoints.com/13-most-michelin-starred-ci...

> Some of the best restaurants in places like NYC, Austin and LA are "basic" restaurants but the food is delicious and cheap.

I agree. Maybe Germans think mayo is spicy as the meme says (currywurst aside). But it is changing.

> The US has some of the best produce in the world, from local farmer's markets to giant Whole Foods

"Best produce" is not necessarily the ones that look better on a shelf. Berlin is not lacking in organic produce and supermarkets. Or just fruit/veg stalls.

Oh and before I forget, don't shop at discount supermarkets.

lol - I'm always fascinated with the fixation on guns in the US. Outside of a few urban areas with brain-dead local policies that exacerbate and end up promoting it, gun violence isn't much worse than other kinds of violence combined vs. other countries. Indeed in totality the US is probably below the other averages.

I mean is there still talk of banning people in London from having a steak knife on their person while in public? Take away guns and people will use other tools to carry out violence they might be intending.

Which is the real issue - people, not the tools/weapons. Fixating on tools is easier than those pesky humans, so I get why people tend to do that.

I think it was Heinlein that popularized "an armed society is a polite society" - turns out its more than mere theory or a pithy saying: https://neonnettle.com/features/1909-a-georgia-town-once-req...

Which areas would you recommend to avoid there and which areas are good to be a SWE in?