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Trump to impose $100k fee for H-1B worker visas, White House says

(www.reuters.com)
1245 points mriguy | 27 comments | 19 Sep 25 19:59 UTC | HN request time: 0.007s | source | bottom
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roughly ◴[19 Sep 25 20:40 UTC] No.45306289[source]▶
I think there’s plenty of interesting debates to be had about immigration policy and its effects on the labor market, but one thing worth noting here is that the primary problem that damn near every other country on earth has isn’t immigration, it’s brain drain.

A core strategic strength of the US over the last century has been that everyone with any talent wants to come here to work, and by and large we’ve let them do so. You can argue how well that’s worked out for us - having worked with a great many extremely talented H1bs in an industry largely built by immigrants, I’d consider it pretty positive - but it damn sure hasn’t worked out well for the countries those talented folks came from.

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jpadkins ◴[19 Sep 25 20:49 UTC] No.45306392[source]▶
The top end of H1B has been great for America. In the last few decades, there has been growth of abuse of the program to get mid level talent at below market rates which really hurts the middle class in America. People need to understand that most reformists don't want to get rid of the truly exceptional immigration to the US. We need to limit the volume, especially the immigrants that are directly competing with a hollowed out middle class in the US. Let me know if you want further reading on this topic.
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jb1991 ◴[19 Sep 25 20:54 UTC] No.45306452[source]▶
This is exactly correct. The H1B visa has not lived up to its original premise in quite some time. A very significant percentage of people who are now working on these visas are not offering anything beyond what is already available within the American workforce, except for lower compensation.
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1. whatever1 ◴[19 Sep 25 21:14 UTC] No.45306699[source]▶
From the reuters table it seems that the biggest H1B beneficiaries are FAANG.

Do you suggest that they check the immigration status and offer to some people lower compensation because of their status?

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2. mothballed ◴[19 Sep 25 21:35 UTC] No.45306938[source]▶
No need to check immigration status. If they're non-white and have an accent it's already a tell you can lowball them. You'd probably skip over some white europeans with solid English, but lets be real, those people can fake being a US citizen easy enough with some trivially obtained paperwork.
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3. whatever1 ◴[19 Sep 25 21:47 UTC] No.45307076[source]▶
It appears that you have a strong case of discrimination. You should consider filing a lawsuit.

This is precisely what HR and hiring managers at FAANG companies are instructed and trained to avoid.

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4. mothballed ◴[19 Sep 25 21:53 UTC] No.45307140{3}[source]▶
I'm speaking in a hypothetical, not something I've witnessed. I doubt anyone ever witnesses it willfully happen. All that is necessary is the incentives be in place for

1) Hiring manager to have incentive to hire quality talent at the most economical price

2) Foreign talent be more desperate than domestic talent

The effect is practically guaranteed even if there is exactly zero intent by the hiring manager or any conscious 'discrimination.' Incentives beget results and people may not ponder how they got there, and they often don't.

Unless you change (1) or (2) all the discrimination legislation, lawsuits, and 'training' in the world isn't worth the paper it is written on.

5. conartist6 ◴[19 Sep 25 22:19 UTC] No.45307412[source]▶
If you already have an immigration status that allows you to work in the US then you're free to advocate for your worth by engaging with the job market. If a company has to sponsor you for an H1B though you'll be locked to one employer, and that lack of options is what means they don't need to give you market rates.

But yes, as far as I know companies would usually offer an H1B applicant lower salary. They know the candidate will need visa sponsorship because the candidate has to say up front (usually in the first conversation) if they are authorized to work in the US. If the companies know they will have to undertake costly sponsorship, and as far as I know employment law leaves them quite free to offer a lower salary: foreign nationals are not a protected class so salary discrimination on the basis of who will need visa sponsorship is just to be expected in the current system...

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6. xp84 ◴[19 Sep 25 22:20 UTC] No.45307419[source]▶
Are you suggesting that those companies don't know they're hiring H-1B workers? It just sort of happens to them?

If they offer below-market (for American workers) salaries and get no sufficiently-qualified domestic candidates, as they're required to promise they do, it's no surprise to anyone that they're hiring a ton of H-1Bs. They want that because they want to pay less.

I don't blame them for doing what's fiscally advantageous for the shareholders up till now -- but I think I'll be glad to see this change implemented, if it is, because I know companies write on those forms "domestic talent not found" when they know the truth is "domestic talent not available at the wages we'd like to pay".

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7. conartist6 ◴[19 Sep 25 22:21 UTC] No.45307435[source]▶
That would be highly illegal: it'd be discrimination on the basis of race (which is protected under the law) rather than on the basis of immigration status (which is not protected).
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8. mothballed ◴[19 Sep 25 22:23 UTC] No.45307456{3}[source]▶
For it to be illegal you have to prove intent.

The incentives ensure that it will happen with zero intent, and probably without the people doing it even realize they're doing it. It's not illegal to see someone, think of them as a 'sucker' but not even realize why, then lowball them, which is far more likely than for a person to actually consciously confront themselves they may be a racist.

In any case, even if they know it's illegal, it's not so easy to enforce, the fact that people get successfully sued or jailed a small fraction of the time isn't going to be some solace.

The only way to actually solve it is to remove the incentive in place, namely either the market pressure to get the best developer at the cheapest price or the vulnerability of being an immigrant.

9. zaptheimpaler ◴[19 Sep 25 22:27 UTC] No.45307493[source]▶
The basic mechanics you're assuming are wrong - H1B is not locked to an employer, it can be easily transferred between employers. H1B is tied to having AN employer, but employees are free to switch between employers to get market rates and they do.
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10. laurencerowe ◴[19 Sep 25 22:28 UTC] No.45307499[source]▶
> If a company has to sponsor you for an H1B though you'll be locked to one employer, and that lack of options is what means they don't need to give you market rates.

You're not locked into one employer on an H1B. Once you are here it is possible to switch jobs relatively easily since you do not need to go through the lottery again.

> as far as I know employment law leaves them quite free to offer a lower salary

"The H-1B employer must pay its H-1B worker(s) at least the “required” wage which is the higher of the prevailing wage or the employer’s actual wage (in-house wage) for similarly employed workers."

https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fact-sheets/62g-h1b-require...

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11. smsm42 ◴[19 Sep 25 22:32 UTC] No.45307534[source]▶
What do you mean "suggest"? Every single job application I've ever seen has a question about citizenship/status. And of course they'd know whether they need to file legal papers to employ you as H1B or not - it's not like it somehow happens in secret. They know who's visa worker and who's not.
12. conartist6 ◴[19 Sep 25 23:00 UTC] No.45307784{3}[source]▶
My understanding was that by changing jobs you could "lose your place in line" potentially costing you years of waiting in your overall immigration process.
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13. kimixa ◴[19 Sep 25 23:20 UTC] No.45307965{4}[source]▶
That is true if you have something like an ongoing green card petition. However, if it's just an H1B, by the time it's approved and can transfer it, there's not really a "line" anymore.

Though there's pretty hard limitations on what you can transfer with - it has to be the same sector, similar limitations on minimum salary, and requires work on the new employer's part to move the H1B to them (so you can't keep it quiet, and it's another barrier as it's non-zero cost for lawyers etc. to actually do that).

14. laurencerowe ◴[19 Sep 25 23:40 UTC] No.45308119{4}[source]▶
You are allowed to change jobs after the green card petition has been pending 180 days. Add another 6-9 months for the PERM process.

https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-...

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15. _DeadFred_ ◴[20 Sep 25 00:15 UTC] No.45308392{5}[source]▶
Does your new company need to file paperwork? Have/consult an immigration lawyer? I know our jobs openings we always specified we weren't willing to sponsor because we didn't have the ability to do the overhead. Do you mean we could have hired H1Bs and my management teams were all mistaken?

most of us here have been hiring managers in the bay area so we have been exposed to this. My exposure was you are fairly locked into one company. I had friends who had to go home abruptly when fired. We would have to buy their cars so we could sell them slower at non-fire sale prices for them. But this was late 90s through early 2000s. Maybe it's different.

16. Amezarak ◴[20 Sep 25 01:02 UTC] No.45308735{3}[source]▶
We've all seen hiring managers that coincidentally hired only or nearly only their fellow countrymen, and nothing happens to them, even though it is highly illegal.
17. maest ◴[20 Sep 25 02:10 UTC] No.45309507[source]▶
FAANG offers sub market salaries? American citizens turn their nose at FAANG jobs because of the low pay?

What?

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18. mlrtime ◴[20 Sep 25 03:56 UTC] No.45310210{3}[source]▶
FAANG relative to FAANG, not FAANG relative to a barista at Starbucks. You get how this works right?
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19. mlrtime ◴[20 Sep 25 03:59 UTC] No.45310230[source]▶
The casual racism against white people that we normalize is sick. I understand the current situation and the past, but it doesn't make it right.
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20. jb1991 ◴[20 Sep 25 04:43 UTC] No.45310460[source]▶
I can’t quite follow the logic of your question, it seems maybe you either don’t understand my comment or you don’t understand how this visa works.
21. femiagbabiaka ◴[20 Sep 25 04:47 UTC] No.45310477{3}[source]▶
lol
22. taiwan_num1 ◴[20 Sep 25 04:51 UTC] No.45310501{4}[source]▶
FAANG offers the exact same salaries to US citizens and those who need sponsorship. And speaking from personal experience, the majority of the Chinese and Indian immigrants at Meta are extremely talented and tremendously hard working. The best Americans are obsessed with startups and entrepreneurship and aren’t satisfied with being cogs in the machine the way H1B seekers are.

I’m not saying the system is perfect, we definitely need to work on clearing out these fraudulent consultancies and such. But FAANG H1Bs are good engineers and we would definitely be worse off without them. I much preferred the proposal to only allow H1B after a certain salary threshold of ~200-250k which seems like it would solve the issue.

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23. nick49488171 ◴[20 Sep 25 05:07 UTC] No.45310563[source]▶
They also make hidden job postings and then say "look, no one applied except for H1B applicants!"
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24. fatchan ◴[20 Sep 25 06:01 UTC] No.45310834{3}[source]▶
Hence https://jobs.now/

Get applying, every application sends a H1-B fraudster home (not, but we can wish).

25. Schnitz ◴[20 Sep 25 08:48 UTC] No.45311604{5}[source]▶
The issue that needs fixing with the H1 program isn’t FAANG, it’s Infosys etc.
26. hshdhdhj4444 ◴[20 Sep 25 12:29 UTC] No.45312787{3}[source]▶
Ironically the Trump administration has made it harder to switch with the uncertainty they’ve been creating within the program.
27. geodel ◴[20 Sep 25 13:58 UTC] No.45313474[source]▶
It is useless statistics. In 2024 out of all H1B approved only 2% are for FAANG(~7K out of 400K). The whole debate is about remaining ~95% (adding another 3% for truly hi-tech work). Thats where H1B abuse happening.

Promoters of H1B keep talking about highly talented H1Bs while ignoring a mass hired at very low end of tech jobs.