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275 points starkparker | 4 comments | | HN request time: 0.999s | source
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cortesoft ◴[] No.45133347[source]
So the author talks about how little money per stream artists make... but how much SHOULD they be making? What is fair compensation for writing a song?

In the old days, artists would join a label and put out an album. The artist would earn about 10% of sales or so (varies of course, but on average). So a $15 CD would earn an artist $1.50.

The article lists the 'price per stream' as about $0.005. So it would take about 300 streams of a song to earn the same amount as selling a CD used to make.

I feel like that isn't categorically less money than artists used to make per song listen? There are many albums I own that I have listened to way more than 30 times, which is what it would take for a 10 song album to get 300 song 'streams'

Is that a fair compensation? Why or why not?

I think artists should be able to earn money from creating music, but I don't know how we decide how much they actually deserve if we aren't just going based on the price the market sets.

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0xbadcafebee ◴[] No.45133449[source]
> how little money per stream artists make ... What is fair compensation for writing a song?

Those are two different things. Recording artist does not always equal songwriter. So how much should the songwriter make? The recording studio? The audio engineer? All the other people involved in creating the recorded song? Now that it's made, how do you get people to know the song exists and want to listen to it, much less purchase it?

The reason compensation isn't a settled thing is it's a very complex thing to answer.

The simplest possible answer is "the artist sets their own price" - assuming they just DIY'd the entire production, advertising, distribution, etc themselves. But that is so much work that they would need to already have an income stream to give them the time to do it all, not to mention all the non-music skills if they're not paying professionals to do the rest.

If they're not just going to play at the local coffee shop, or bus from city to city barely making enough for gas and beer, they need some way to professionally produce, mass-market, and mass-distribute their songs. It's not feasible for most musicians to do this themselves, so there exists a music industry to do it... which gives them all the cards... letting them set the price, and contract terms... which are often unfair. That's what happens when an industry is given the power to exploit people: they do.

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parliament32 ◴[] No.45133588[source]
> Those are two different things. Recording artist does not always equal songwriter. So how much should the songwriter make? The recording studio? The audio engineer? All the other people involved in creating the recorded song? Now that it's made, how do you get people to know the song exists and want to listen to it, much less purchase it?

Why are any of these the distribution medium's (or better, listener's) problem? The songwriter, recording studio, audio engineer, marketing firm, etc should be paid for their services at their standard rates at the time the service is performed. The artist is the one who should accept this risk. Just like.. basically everything else in the world. The plumber who installed an office sink is not entitled to some fraction of the occupying organization's revenue, right?

> But that is so much work that they would need to already have an income stream to give them the time to do it all

Which is why labels exist. They take the risk on, and pre-pay for (everything), in exchange for the lion's share of potential revenue. Artists are, of course, welcome to stay unsigned and handle all the risk and rewards themselves, but that typically isn't a good value prop.

IMO everything here is working as designed, including Spotify. The author just doesn't understand that "artists getting paid fractions of pennies per stream" is exactly what should happen.

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AdamJacobMuller ◴[] No.45133855[source]
> should be paid for their services at their standard rates at the time the service is performed

Because by and large they don't want that. They are creatives who would prefer to be invested in their work: Charge less now, putting more into their work in the hope and belief that it will pay off over time. Sometimes it does.

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1. don_quiquong ◴[] No.45134623[source]
Part of what's wrong with the industry. Steve Albini had a flat fee and was one of the most sought after recording engineers (aka producer but he hated the term). And that was based on the quality of his work moreso than his modest, flat fee.
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2. BobaFloutist ◴[] No.45139795[source]
A producer is not remotely the same thing as a recording engineer?
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3. blactuary ◴[] No.45141430[source]
He usually did the job of a producer but he didn't like the term, as he wanted the artist to get all of the credit for creating the art, even through the producer often plays a big role in the final product.
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4. BobaFloutist ◴[] No.45142296{3}[source]
Producers also often contribute singing, instrument playing, and songwriting, so the distinction between them and the "artist" is pretty flimsy. In ways, artist is as much defined as "the person that gets all of the credit for creating the art" as anything else.