First American pope elected and will be known as Pope Leo XIV

The last Leo was a notable pope. His views are well known. You don’t need to memorise everything, a lot of what they’ve said over the years is available in books or online.

Pope Quartz: https://xkcd.com/2501/

I was raised Catholic and couldn't have even told you there'd been a single Pope Leo, let alone 13 of them before today. The only Pope quote I could even give you is the term "Ex Cathedra".

It never ceases to amaze me how poorly catechized the majority of cradle Catholics are. I don't intend this to be directed at you, but it's a standing joke among traditionalist Catholics that "I was raised Catholic" is the preamble to a statement of either ignorance or heresy.

> I don't intend this to be directed at you, but it's a standing joke among traditionalist Catholics that "I was raised Catholic" is the preamble to a statement of either ignorance or heresy.

It's cool, no offence taken.

My mother took it all very seriously, but she was also syncretic New Age/Hindu/Catholic; she got me baptised at birth and took the lead with Sunday school and going to Church etc, my dad was mainly interested in getting me into a good school that was Catholic but himself was atheist.

I actually read the entire New Testament while at school, took it at face value, thought "this doesn't work, does it?" and went to Wicca for a bit before deciding that wasn't for me either.

I think at no point did anyone bother to explain the structure of the Catholic church, they just kinda assumed we all knew it, when what we knew was from pop culture. I think your local priest was unavoidable knowledge, but pop culture gave me bishops, the Pope (but not the fact that his official title isn't that until it came up on the quiz show QI), and the obvious joke about Cardinal Jaime Sin. The actual education gave me no sense of ranks or the organisation or how nuns and monks fit in — just the same five bible tales (birth, walking on water, feeding of 5000, eye of the needle, death and resurrection) over and over again. With singing.

The pattern you've noticed, I think also applies to the UK citizenship test: there's a general sense that most people born with UK nationality wouldn't be able to pass the test to become a citizen as an adult.

Growing up Catholic we learned all that stuff at CCD which was a Wednesday night “Sunday school”. Otherwise no idea how you would pick it up without google.

For most of history 99% of Catholics could not read, much less own a Bible. The fetishization of theology is not necessary to be a good Catholic

Literacy is a great gift which shouldn't be squandered: much will be required of the person entrusted with much, and still more will be demanded of the person entrusted with more. To try to make knowledge of ones spiritual heritage out to be "fetishization" is inappropriate in my estimation. This reminds me of a story told by Dr. Scott Hahn, a Catholic biblical scholar, about an experience he once had (closely paraphrased):

Questioner: "Why do we need to know all of this [bible study, theology, etc]? I can just think of the medieval peasant who is illiterate and thus disqualified from any and everything that you're talking about."

Dr. Hahn: "I think the best response to your question would actually come from the medieval peasant himself, because if you could imagine him standing here next to me he would look at you and say, 'You're using me as an excuse? You have books, you have literacy, you have access to these resources, and you're using me as an excuse to not take advantage of them?'"

Growing up to Scottish and Irish Catholics in England, I remember talking to a bunch of Ulster protestants as a teenager when the topic turned to religion - I said "Well, I was raised Catholic but I'm not really a believer of any kind" and the response was "Ah, so you're one of THOSE Catholics!".

Turns out there are a lot of 'those' Catholics.

I was raised atheist and the education I received on religion was also firmly from an atheist (I guess anthropological?) viewpoint. What we were taught was that religion in theory (e.g. what is written in the holy books) and religion as it's actually practiced can often be quite different and none of them is realer than the other. Or something like that, it was a while ago.

Don't go to church, but know which church they are not going to.

Isn't that the point though? To provide a disjunction?

"I was raised Catholic" is like "I'm not racist but".

>It never ceases to amaze me how poorly catechized the majority of cradle Catholics are.

The classic example being asking one "What is the immaculate conception?"

That said, I have no reason to think that the average Catholic is more or less knowledgeable about his religion than any other Christian.

Who the pope is, is not really relevant. It's not like the pope will suddenly go against the key scriptures or something.

Also, most Catholics are born in catholic families so it's not like they chose catholicism over something else.

I would generally agree, except that there is a very well know Pope Leo that anyone who has taken any European history should know about. Pope Leo X that was Pope when Martin Luther kicked off the reformation.

What most people get wrong is that the immaculate conception is the conception of Mary, not Jesus, and is completely different from virgin birth.

No idea how old OP is, but I think there's a pattern amongst Millennial cradle Catholics in particular. You grow up with it, maybe you went to Catholic grade school and high school, perhaps even a Catholic college (Notre Dame if you're lucky, Creighton or Marquette if you didn't get that 1500 on the SAT or a 34 on the ACT that you wanted). And then there's sort of a fork when you hit adulthood. You either drop it and never come back, or you passively drift away and then one day you get married and have kids and start taking it seriously again. I knew the reference because of the latter. I suspect there's a lot of Millennial Catholics who are like that.

This is to say, or rather explain, that I respect those who convert and have a predilection to Traditionalism. Part of the reason cradle Catholics drifted away is that the boomer generation basically ruined the mystique and the tradition, so when you're a kid it just felt like another chore.

The OP AKA Dominicans date back to 1216.

Haha obviously I’m kidding you but that’s truly tangentially relevant

For most of history even a single book of the Bible would cost a princely sum.

Even today a single manuscript vellum scroll is a significant expense.

Bibles were the first book to sell in large numbers when the printing press was invented.

Before that the church did expect at least priests and monks and nuns to be able to read the Bible, and there were a lot of them.

Most is strictly true, but you are talking about a millennium between the clear primacy of Rome and the invention of the printing press, and half a millennium since so its not hugely more.

Finally, historically most people could not own books and had no to limited literacy. Literacy is not necessary to be a good anything, but its definitely better to be literate and have access to things to read.

> Also, most Catholics are born in catholic families so it's not like they chose catholicism over something else.

I do not know whether that is true any more, at least in all countries. At one Catholic parish I knew in Britain about half the congregation were adult converts.

Then there are a lot of people who leave and return. I might count as that - Catholic family, was agnostic (and married in registry office, which turned out to be useful), and now am definitely a Christian but feel denomination does not matter and do not really accept much of the Catholic theology (and some of its practical consequences, such as no women priests really bother me). OTOH I have not, and would not, formally leave the church either.

Who the president is, is not really relevant. It's not like the president will suddenly go against the constitution or something.

Bring serious, it's kind of important due to the Pope's infallibility.

Or Catholic primary/secondary education.

But still, both are highly variable in quality/coverage and likely much less consistent than you might assume if unfamiliar with the space.

Irrelevant analogy. You can't change country super easily but you can stop being a Catholic in 5 seconds if you decide it.

Apostasy is not that quick or easy. Depending on a country the church can fight you on that.

> you can stop being a Catholic in 5 seconds if you decide it.

How does one officially leave the Catholic Church?

Sure, you can stop attending church and taking communion, but you're still on a list somewhere in your parish(es).

Being on a list means what? How does that impact your life?

Any example?

Some places have church tax based on your religion, such as Germany. I've heard varying claims from locals about the difficulty of leaving organised religion, though for me as an Auslander it was as easy as just saying "none" in the right box when setting up my tax ID.

I am aware of Germany but that's an exception. In no other (developed) country are your taxes tied to your faith.

A phenomenon that I see all too often is the absurdity of young adults who try to plow through writings of St. Thomas Aquinas and the Church Fathers, which is great, so when do they have time to read Scripture itself?

I think it's great that literacy and the printing press has democratized the reading of books, but when you're faced with such a corpus presented by Catholic tradition, you really need to pick and choose your weekly time investments!

I've inquired with a few religious orders as a layperson. The first thing you will find when inquiring with them is the thickness of tomes that land on the table for all adherents to read. Each religious order has a particular spirituality that is synthesized in the writings of saints and mystics. So if I was not already well-acquainted and well-grounded in the Old and New Testaments, and in the habit of reading those every day, what good would it do me to read Aquinas? Or Leo XIII encyclicals? Pointless.

The Bible itself has so many layers and aspects and messages for us. Many scholars invest entire lifetimes in understanding only the Bible. The only way to be a good Christian is to live the life. It doesn't matter what books you've read, at the end of the day, only your experience and your response to the Holy Spirit. If that means reading books, then good. If that means welding metal, also good. But, don't try to break open the words of Aquinas before you've read Daniel, or Matthew!