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349 points pseudolus | 21 comments | | HN request time: 0.625s | source | bottom
1. Izkata ◴[] No.42473930[source]
> But, according to data released Tuesday, the number of eighth, 10th, and 12th graders who collectively abstained from the use of alcohol, marijuana, or nicotine hit a new high this year. Use of illicit drugs also fell on the whole and use of non-heroin narcotics (Vicodin, OxyContin, Percocet) hit an all-time low.

From an unexpected conversation with some younger people not long ago (though not this young), they may have just switched to LSD.

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2. fullshark ◴[] No.42473936[source]
They switched to smartphones
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3. carlosjobim ◴[] No.42474008[source]
You don't use LSD habitually. If they switched to LSD, then that's very interesting.
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4. codr7 ◴[] No.42474041[source]
Some do, and that's fine too.
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5. jsheard ◴[] No.42474085[source]
Notably absent from those stats is nitrous oxide, which has had a resurgence in popularity lately.

https://archive.is/wRa3Q

6. smartmic ◴[] No.42474114[source]
This. And what about the psychosocial consequences, will it be an improvement compared to the other substances? I doubt it.
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7. kamikazeturtles ◴[] No.42474136{3}[source]
“If you get the message, hang up the phone. For psychedelic drugs are simply instruments, like microscopes, telescopes, and telephones. The biologist does not sit with eye permanently glued to the microscope, he goes away and works on what he has seen.” ― Alan Watts
replies(1): >>42483656 #
8. prerok ◴[] No.42474163{3}[source]
While I don't think smartphone addiction should be taken lightly, it's still a far cry from substance abuse.
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9. PittleyDunkin ◴[] No.42474325{3}[source]
LSD is not a drug that you can develop an addiction to. Habit is one thing—some people take it regularly—but it doesn't work very well if you do take it frequently.

Which is not to say that LSD can't potentially be harmful. Of course it can. But it's not very analogous to the typically destructive drugs (alcohol, amphetamines, strong opiates) and it's not going to mess with your dopamine the way they do.

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10. alephnerd ◴[] No.42474330{3}[source]
> will it be an improvement compared to the other substances? I doubt it

Smartphone addiction beats having cirrhosis.

Therapy's cheaper than a liver transplant.

11. UniverseHacker ◴[] No.42474402[source]
Anyone that has experienced LSD would know that what you are saying is impossible and makes zero sense. Other than both being chemicals, the effects are so radically different that they have no interchangeable purpose. Specifically LSD cannot be used to escape trauma or negative emotions, if anything it does the opposite and makes you confront them head on, often terrifyingly so, and as such LSD has something like negative addictiveness. It’s like saying someone switched from using staples to orange juice- it’s an incoherent statement.
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12. s1artibartfast ◴[] No.42474443{4}[source]
I'm not so sure, especially if you look at the sum societal impact, and not just the worst outcomes.

My personal take is that the net social impact is positive for alcohol, marijuana, hallucinogens, and maybe some of the party drugs. For most people, they tend to be a social lubricant, tool for exploration, and source of fun.

I think that smartphone use probably balances out negatively. I think for most people, they have a pretty severe negative impact on their lives, and for some, an extremely negative impact.

The worst outcomes for drug use are probably worse than those for smartphones, but not by too much in my opinion.

13. Nextgrid ◴[] No.42474794{4}[source]
Substance abuse is pretty much universally understood to be wrong (including by the addicts themselves, but they lack the help to get out of it).

Social media usage on the other hand has been normalized and now humanity's social fabric is in the control of a few companies who are happy to rent it out to the highest bidder. This has obvious implications regarding democracy, surveillance, misinformation, etc.

From a society perspective, I'll take substance/alcohol abuse any day because it appears to be self-regulating at a level that while is higher than we'd like, is much lower than what it takes to destabilize society and democracy.

14. pvaldes ◴[] No.42474897{3}[source]
> Some do, and that's fine too.

And those should learn something from Syd Barret's life

Could had been a millionaire rock star, women, expensive toys, children. He could had everything for the rest of his life. But he choose LSD. As a lot of people claim, LSD is a cool and harmless funny drug, right?.

His life instead was: living in his mum house since 24 Yo, with his brain like a car crash, and all the time in the world to think on his boy room about how he managed to mess up his life so badly.

So thanks, but no way.

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15. carlosjobim ◴[] No.42474933{3}[source]
Not in the same way as alcohol, weed or cigarettes. Not even close.
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16. Izkata ◴[] No.42475751[source]
The study makes no distinction between that and recreational use. "Getting drunk with friends" counted, for example.

Besides if anything I'd say current generations have less trauma to avoid so they're more likely to use it than past generations.

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17. ◴[] No.42476061{3}[source]
18. quesera ◴[] No.42480389{4}[source]
I don't think you can speak authoritatively about Syd Barrett's life, or his mental health issues.

Those that can, do not agree that LSD was causative.

Syd was not the only person doing LSD in the 1960s, and if your argument boils down to "people with life-long major neurodivergence, who are living multiple years of extraordinarily stressful life, should not do huge amounts of psychedelic drugs" ... then OK! That's a good rule of thumb!

But the vast majority of people are not latent schizophrenics. And the vast majority of drug users could not approach Syd's consumption in quantity or duration.

So an argument from the same data is that occasional or even moderate use of LSD by almost every adult human, is perfectly safe.

...

Reframed: Every adult can make their own decisions about their personal level of risk tolerance. Hopefully the decision will be an informed one. Syd Barrett can be a huge terrifying red flag, or a bright illuminating green light, depending on the decisions you've made.

On one extreme of risk tolerance, you'd never leave the house. On the other extreme, (with some bad luck, some excellent luck, and a great deal of effort and resources!) you might approach Syd Barrett's lifestyle. Neither extreme is appropriate for most people.

19. codr7 ◴[] No.42483656{4}[source]
Even Alan Watts wasn't right about everything.

This is fine as far as his personal preferences go; as for everyone else, none of his business.

20. codr7 ◴[] No.42483663{4}[source]
You can develop a psychological addiction to any experience, and some like LSD.

Once every week or so for a while is perfectly doable.

Agreed, very different kinds of substances.

21. codr7 ◴[] No.42483707{4}[source]
Weed comes close at high doses but no two drugs are the same.