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Trump wins presidency for second time

(thehill.com)
1796 points koolba | 14 comments | 06 Nov 24 06:49 UTC | HN request time: 0s | source | bottom
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drawkward ◴[06 Nov 24 15:33 UTC] No.42063854[source]▶
It's the economy, stupid:

-Inflation is not prices; it is the rate of change in prices. Low inflation doesn't imply low prices. -Aggregate statistics don't necessarily explain individual outcomes.

The Dems failed on this count massively, and have, for maybe the last 40 years, which is about the amount of time it took for my state to go from national bellwether (As goes Ohio, so goes the nation) to a reliably red state. This cost one of the most pro-union Senators (Sherrod Brown) his job.

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UncleOxidant ◴[06 Nov 24 18:23 UTC] No.42066822[source]▶
> The Dems failed on this count massively

What was their failure here? The failure to explain to the economically illiterate that while inflation is now about where it was prior to covid that prices won't be going down (unless there's some sort of major recession leading to deflation)?

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ComplexSystems ◴[06 Nov 24 19:02 UTC] No.42067493[source]▶
The failure is in this very common exchange

Average voter: I can't afford groceries at the store. Inflation sucks.

Response: Actually, here is the correct definition of "inflation." As you can see from the correct definition, inflation rates are now good! Hopefully this helps you understand why things will never get better.

What the average voter hears: I can't afford groceries. Your solution to this problem is to reframe the current situation as "good." I still can't afford groceries.

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whoknew1122 ◴[06 Nov 24 19:11 UTC] No.42067645[source]▶
But what is the response that works?

Average: I can't afford groceries at the store. Inflation sucks.

Response: Well, inflation plays a part, but grocery stores are still recording record profits despite inflation.

Average: Are you suggesting grocery stores shouldn't make as much money as they can? Free market hater! Communist!

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1. ComplexSystems ◴[06 Nov 24 19:31 UTC] No.42067947[source]▶
Well, for starters, a response that would have worked won't involve both of these contradictory positions at the same time:

Position 1: Prices can never go down again unless inflation is negative and we get "deflation." Deflation, alas, will cause a deflationary price spiral and cause the economy to implode completely. Why? Well, reasons. Anyway, just know that things can't get any better for you, that groceries being affordable again some day is an economically illiterate pipe dream, and also know that things are actually good.

Position 2: Also, we'll just force stores to lower prices. Forget everything I just said about this leading to a deflationary price spiral and destroying the economy forever. Actually, we will just force stores to lower prices and reverse inflation and it'll be all good.

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2. EricDeb ◴[06 Nov 24 19:40 UTC] No.42068095[source]▶
The best solution imo would have been 1. to run a candidate not associated with Biden. 2. To say "inflation happened globally" and double and triple down on that. Half baked solutions like you're suggesting from someone associated with Biden + gaslighting the public that its not that bad were not the answers people wanted.
3. carom ◴[06 Nov 24 19:57 UTC] No.42068379[source]▶
More reasonable would be to explain the grocery prices will likely never come back down but we can increase workers' wages through certain policies. Biden's policy of opening the border to undocumented labor is not a policy that I believe will help increase the wages of those concerned about the cost of groceries.
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4. Izikiel43 ◴[06 Nov 24 20:44 UTC] No.42069062[source]▶
It could lower cost by having cheap labor, but only if that labor was AG focused, otherwise it's a race to the bottom for other jobs.
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5. TimTheTinker ◴[06 Nov 24 21:16 UTC] No.42069521[source]▶
how about an alternative:

Position 3: Introduce policies that stimulate domestic production and decrease foreign competition. This will lower prices without forcing domestic producers out of business.

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6. Qworg ◴[06 Nov 24 22:05 UTC] No.42070193[source]▶
Why would this lower prices?
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7. TimTheTinker ◴[06 Nov 24 22:40 UTC] No.42070667{3}[source]▶
Absent other changes in variables, increasing supply generally leads to lower prices.
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8. Qworg ◴[06 Nov 24 22:51 UTC] No.42070809{4}[source]▶
Why would it increase supply? You've reduced international supply in exchange for increasing domestic supply.

Promoting internal business isn't a sure thing - particularly when tariffs reduce competitive pressures.

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9. throwaway48476 ◴[06 Nov 24 23:47 UTC] No.42071410{3}[source]▶
Ag is waiting to wages to rise for investment in automation to become profitable.
10. infinite8s ◴[07 Nov 24 00:56 UTC] No.42072028[source]▶
This position underlies Trump's tariffs promise.
11. amanaplanacanal ◴[07 Nov 24 01:27 UTC] No.42072262[source]▶
Biden's what policy now? Republicans claim he "opened the border", but I haven't seen any evidence of it.
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12. themaninthedark ◴[07 Nov 24 04:28 UTC] No.42073402{3}[source]▶
https://www.voanews.com/a/usa_biden-signs-executive-orders-r...

>Biden’s immediate focus is on the 3,100-kilometer southern border with Mexico, where Trump tried to keep thousands of migrants from Mexico, Honduras, El Salvador and Guatemala from entering the U.S.

https://nypost.com/2021/02/02/biden-signs-3-executive-orders... >Mayorkas assured senators at a confirmation hearing last month that a plan to end the Trump-brokered “Remain in Mexico” policy requiring Central Americans to await an asylum decision in Mexico won’t necessarily happen immediately. He urged people not to rush to the border hoping for more favorable treatment.

... A few moments later.....

https://nypost.com/2024/03/22/us-news/monthly-record-for-feb... >The nation’s besieged southern border set a record for February(2024) migrant encounters with 189,922 attempted crossings as officials brace for an expected spring surge, according to new Customs and Border Patrol data. >The figure eclipses the prior February record of 166,010 encounters, set in 2022 and 156,000 during the same month last year(2023).

13. TimTheTinker ◴[08 Nov 24 12:35 UTC] No.42086368{5}[source]▶
Reduced competitive pressure is a boon to business.

The less competitive pressure there is, the more likely it is that new businesses will form -- it lowers the bar and makes it easier to start new ventures.

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14. Qworg ◴[08 Nov 24 17:47 UTC] No.42088818{6}[source]▶
The first part is arguable, the second isn't - it just isn't true. Usually, you get large, monopolistic industries that are propped up by the state. So worse products and services than what's available internationally for higher costs as you don't have to compete against all comers. Only a few countries have ever escaped this trap - there's a great Odd Lots about it: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/this-is-how-industrial...