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427 points JumpCrisscross | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0.195s | source
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skhunted ◴[] No.41904004[source]
I’ve been teaching in higher education for 30 years and am soon retiring. I teach math. In every math course there is massive amounts of cheating on everything that is graded that is not proctored in a classroom setting. Locking down browsers and whatnot does not prevent cheating.

The only solution is to require face-to-face proctored exams and not allow students to use technology of any kind while taking the test. But any teacher doing this will end up with no students signing up for their class. The only solution I see is the Higher Learning Commission mandating this for all classes.

But even requiring in person proctored exams is not the full solution. Students are not used to doing the necessary work to learn. They are used to doing the necessary work to pass. And that work is increasingly cheating. It’s a clusterfuck. I have calculus students who don’t know how to work with fractions. If we did truly devise a system that prevents cheating we’ll see that a very high percentage of current college students are not ready to be truly college educated.

K-12 needs to be changed as well.

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bonoboTP ◴[] No.41904319[source]
> The only solution is to require face-to-face proctored exams and not allow students to use technology of any kind while taking the test.

In Germany, all exams are like this. Homework assignments are either just a prerequisite for taking exam but the grade is solely from the exam, or you may get some small point bonus for assignments/projects.

> But any teacher doing this will end up with no students signing up for their class.

The main courses are mandatory in order to obtain the degree. You can't "not sign up" for linear algebra if it's in your curriculum. Fail 3 times and you're exmatriculated.

This is because universities are paid from tax money in Germany and most of Europe.

The US will continue down on the path you describe because it's in the interest of colleges to keep well-paying students around. It's a service. You buy a degree, you are a customer.

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2OEH8eoCRo0 ◴[] No.41904545[source]
> The main courses are mandatory in order to obtain the degree. You can't "not sign up" for linear algebra if it's in your curriculum.

The course might be mandatory but which professor you choose isn't. What if multiple professors teach it? Word gets around and everyone chooses the easy profs.

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bonoboTP ◴[] No.41904791[source]
In Germany, there's no such choice. There are no competing alternative courses that can substitute for each other, the very thought seems rather strange.

There is one Linear Algebra course. You have to pass it to get your degree. Typically, it's taught by the same prof for many years, but it might also rotate between different chairs and profs (but only one in each semester and the "design" and requirements of the course stays largely the same).

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Jcampuzano2 ◴[] No.41904865[source]
It seems more strange in my opinion that you'd never have a course thats popular enough that more than one teacher holds sessions for it.

You don't have the choice to not take the class, you just have choice with which professor you would like to take it with. And often you would have to get lucky anyway, since that session may be filled so you'd have to take it with the "harder" teacher anyway.

For example with the popularity of computer science and STEM in general, at my school there were often 2-3 teachers teaching linear algebra in any given semester. And same for popular classes like calculus or introductory physics. Students would often lookup online which teacher was considered easier, but they still had to take the class.

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hnaccount_rng ◴[] No.41905002[source]
Why would you do that? It doubles the workload for the faculty and gains.. nothing? That's the whole point of a lecture: You have one person teaching many. Beyond very small lectures (<10 people) it really doesn't get to direct interactions anyhow (or it's really, really hard to get students to interact with you. I tried..).

Especially something like Linear Algebra can easily have class sizes of 800+ people at big universities. Yes there is typically exactly one lecture hall for that and you have 30+ exercise groups. But still only one faculty

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1. Jcampuzano2 ◴[] No.41905108[source]
Sorry I'm not implying I have any practical reason why this is the case. Its just how it was when I was in school.

But I'll say where I went to school, and I hear its even worse now since enrollment in STEM is way up, there were often multiple thousands of students every quarter wanting to take just one class, so they split it up because we simply didn't have lecture halls with enough seats. There would often be 3-4 classes each of 500+ students all full, and still students struggling to get in due to the maximum amount per course. Usually there was around two teachers splitting the sessions, and they also have their other more advanced courses and/or research.

So its probably just practicality in terms of their time and resources. This wasn't an issue with more advanced courses where there was usually only one teacher per semester offering the class.