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568 points rntn | 9 comments | | HN request time: 0.898s | source | bottom
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freedomben ◴[] No.41882500[source]
It's ironic that farmers (traditionally thought of as less technical people, "workers of the earth", etc) and hackers (highly technical nerds writing operating systems and engineering compatibility parts) are so connected by this issue. Some of the farmers I've talked to understand the importance ownership and right to repair better than even many engineers.

That said, I think John Deere is just the asshole willing to weaponize the legal system to enforce their dreams. The real problem is laws that protect IP like the DMCA and the patent system. I'm not saying we should just delete all those, but they are in bad need of reform and enable a tremendous amount of abuse. The abuse is only going to get worse unless we treat the cause(s) rather than just the symptoms.

I'm glad the feds are giving John Deere some attention, but I really hope they are going to fix the lopsided system instead of just try to bully or micro-regulate John Deere into "voluntarily" allowing more repair. If we stopped unleashing the lawyers on people for modifying or interfacing with devices they purchased, it would shift the balance of power more toward the center (whereas currently the power is almost entirely on the side of the companies).

Even if you have no interest in repairing or "tinkering" with your own stuff, you should be on the side of right to repair.

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simonsarris ◴[] No.41882740[source]
Many people (including comments on hacker news!) have called farmers the original hackers. The amount of bespoke problem solving needed is tremendous. Uniformity in farming is an extremely recent phenomenon.

eg: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=626534

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spacecadet ◴[] No.41882945[source]
Yeah... I grew up on a multi-generational family farm and we hacked everything to repair or extend its functionality.

Or just consider animal husbandry at its roots, OG bio hacking...

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1. cogman10 ◴[] No.41883077[source]
Not just animal husbandry. Modern corn is the result of centuries of genetic engineering.

Farmers have long used bio engineering to make crops tastier or more resistant to disease or drought.

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2. spacecadet ◴[] No.41883123[source]
Oh I know, a relative was bio-chem at monsanto related to corn... but I normally avoid telling people that because of the stigma it carries (unfair considering the global impact to yield)... now he works tirelessly to reduce invasive species to reduce coastal erosion.
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3. inanutshellus ◴[] No.41883191[source]
> unfair considering the global impact to yield

The Monsanto stigma is well-earned by its legal teams, much to the chagrin of its many Monsanto biochem employees that saw (and see) the company as a creator of good in the world.

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4. mistrial9 ◴[] No.41883205[source]
this purposefully blurs the distinction between pairing natural breeding versus invasive engineering.. often repeated by people in favor of invasive engineering
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5. spacecadet ◴[] No.41883247{3}[source]
Exactly, I dont deny this. He retired early.
6. spacecadet ◴[] No.41883255[source]
What an assumption. We're just having a fun conversation.
7. cogman10 ◴[] No.41883304[source]
Because "invasive engineering" is just systematized "natural breeding".

People that don't understand this think that the production of GMO crops is done by scientists gene splicing scary chemicals into food products.

What is actually done is scientist get a genetic profile of crops, look for genes in crops that behave in a way they like, and bread crops with those genes. Exactly what "natural breeding" does, except for maybe the fact that it can be far more targeted with the genetic information.

There is a downside to this, it often results in highly homogeneous genetics in plants. However, that's a problem we already have with "natural" processes (see: bananas and most citrus fruits).

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8. aegypti ◴[] No.41883381[source]
Yes this is why eg the French bombard seeds with extraordinary amounts of radiation to get desired sets of random mutations, it’s much more natural and less invasive.
9. mypalmike ◴[] No.41884720{3}[source]
You are describing selective breeding.

GMO is different. It involves the laboratory isolation of genes, and techniques to introduce said genes into an organism such that its DNA is altered. These technique do include gene splicing.

Golden rice is one well known example. It is a GMO plant which has been modified with genes taken from daffodils and a bacteria called erwinium uredovora. It's not just breeding existing species for good qualities.