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Ask HN: Who has moved from the U.S. to Europe?

181 points feraligators | 23 comments | 25 Jan 22 15:44 UTC | HN request time: 3.396s | source | bottom

I've long considered leaving this country for a multitude of reasons.

I'd be curious to hear some first hand experiences of those who've made the move to Europe and what you think of the process and considerations one should make.

A few questions to start the conversation:

- Where do you live?

- What's the biggest sacrifice you had to make (i.e. pay, housing, friends, etc.)

- What have you gained?

Show context
boffinAudio ◴[25 Jan 22 15:54 UTC] No.30073204[source]▶
I've done it, and it was one of the best decisions of my life.

WHERE: I'm Australian, moved to LA when I was 18 and lived there for 15 years. Then, I moved from Los Angeles to Germany (Duesseldorf), and then to Vienna, Austria.

WHAT SACRIFICE: No more In 'n Out Burger, no more decent Mexican/TexMex food, no more LA food trucks. These are literally the only things I miss about the USA. Literally every other aspect of life has improved massively by leaving the USA - healthcare, food, social life. For the first 4 years I walked to work, ffs. Now I ride a bicycle in combination with the best public transportation options in the world (Austria, Vienna).

GAINED: I've completely lost the brain-dead nationalist mentality that had infected me in my earlier life, I've gained Immense amounts of respect for humanity, I've learned German, I've experienced professional software and hardware development away from Silicon Valley standard practices, and I get to see the USA from outside the decadent, rose-colored bubble from which it is usually experienced. I honestly wish I'd left sooner - every time I go back I'm reminded just how much of a shithole the USA really is ..

Plus, living and loving in Europe is just great. There is no greater joy than a trip through the Balkans for a week adventure, or maybe a jaunt to Spain or southern France. Just being able to travel an hour in any direction and being immersed in absolutely foreign culture is a joy like no other. Definitely a great way to ground oneself.

EDIT: The weather was pretty good in LA. But, still: Americans.

replies(17): >>30073369 #>>30073389 #>>30073431 #>>30073510 #>>30073522 #>>30073528 #>>30073595 #>>30073647 #>>30073734 #>>30073867 #>>30074068 #>>30074160 #>>30074195 #>>30074985 #>>30075141 #>>30083372 #>>30105824 #
1. FPGAhacker ◴[25 Jan 22 16:06 UTC] No.30073431[source]▶
I don’t know how much of the US you experienced, but LA is hardly representative of the country.
replies(3): >>30073573 #>>30073624 #>>30079331 #
2. exdsq ◴[25 Jan 22 16:18 UTC] No.30073607[source]▶
Does Rust or Go count?
3. systemvoltage ◴[25 Jan 22 16:18 UTC] No.30073612[source]▶
> Americans are an unimpressive, vain and ugly people - who admittedly know how to sell things

Replace Americans with any other nationality and see how offensive this sounds.

replies(1): >>30073674 #
4. anthomtb ◴[25 Jan 22 16:19 UTC] No.30073624[source]▶
LA is representative of everything that sucks about the USA: excessively expensive housing, high crime, car culture and implicit racism. It’s quite clear that the Australian who is attempting to describe the USA as a whole actually has a very narrow view of the country.
replies(1): >>30073669 #
5. ◴[25 Jan 22 16:21 UTC] No.30073669[source]▶
6. vlunkr ◴[25 Jan 22 16:25 UTC] No.30073731[source]▶
Their comment was incredibly mild, and also accurate. Ironic that you're trying to convince people that Europeans are humble and kind.
replies(1): >>30073925 #
7. notch656a ◴[25 Jan 22 16:26 UTC] No.30073748{4}[source]▶
Wow, high roller. Talk about vain. I wasn't talking about money.
replies(1): >>30074069 #
8. ◴[25 Jan 22 16:28 UTC] No.30073776{4}[source]▶
9. boffinAudio ◴[25 Jan 22 16:36 UTC] No.30073896{3}[source]▶
In case you didn't notice, I don't care a fig about Australia these days, but your trigger-finger reactionary response calling out China as a reason why America is 'wonderful' is definitely something I expect from Americans. And, frankly, its boring and tiresome. As is the expectation that anyone with a world view not derived from the idiot box would be impressed by America's war budget. You should be ashamed of what your country does with those billions, yo. Its one of the reasons your country is such a shithole not only for those who live there - but those who are on the other end of the complex machinery that starts with a kid dropping bombs on strangers on the other side of the world, from a nondescript office in an Arizona strip mall ..
replies(2): >>30074286 #>>30074412 #
10. finiteseries ◴[25 Jan 22 16:38 UTC] No.30073925{3}[source]▶
They’re not European though, let’s not forget the zeal of the convert.
replies(1): >>30073965 #
11. exdsq ◴[25 Jan 22 16:41 UTC] No.30073965{4}[source]▶
Which sort of supports their point actually! :P
12. boffinAudio ◴[25 Jan 22 16:47 UTC] No.30074069{5}[source]▶
Well, think of it like this: I worked hard, contributed hard, and chased the American dream. I found it distasteful and repugnant - so I moved.

(And, btw, $2,000,000 is hardly "high-roller" status, spread out in taxes over 15 years... unless of course you're one of those "living under a bridge because medical bankrupcy" Americans, lol..)

replies(1): >>30081512 #
13. justforfunhere ◴[25 Jan 22 16:57 UTC] No.30074268{3}[source]▶
Wow, Not only did you not misfire with that statement, but you actually bolstered OP's arguments ... Well done!!
14. notch656a ◴[25 Jan 22 16:58 UTC] No.30074286{4}[source]▶
>Its one of the reasons your country is such a shithole not only for those who live there

This is purely inflammatory rhetoric. Ironically coming from someone who immigrated, was afforded the opportunity to make enough to pay $2M in taxes in 15 years (and even goes on to brag about this payment funding blowing up brown kids), and found the "American Dream" by his own statement.

You're free to hate America. We're free to be happy you left. But really you're gone, just go on enjoying your life. America isn't perfect and has a lot of problems but I'm much happier here than I would be in Europe, it's definitely not a "shithole" to me, my family, or most of the people I know.

15. nexuist ◴[25 Jan 22 17:07 UTC] No.30074412{4}[source]▶
I am an immigrant from Albania. American bombs ended the Kosovo genocide. I have reasons to be grateful for this military and I can be upset and disappointed in it at the same time.

I did not say America is wonderful. I don't know why you even quoted that word, when it did not appear in my post. I claimed American taxpayers protect Australia's sovereignty. Obviously your state can do better things with its budget when its defense is bankrolled by someone else. I do not care where you live, your quality of life would plummet if the prospect of being invaded by Russia or China was a real one, a prospect you are protected from through American military supremacy. See Ukraine.

replies(1): >>30086367 #
16. elliotec ◴[25 Jan 22 22:58 UTC] No.30079331[source]▶
No single place in the country is representative of the country.
17. pandaman ◴[26 Jan 22 03:57 UTC] No.30081512{6}[source]▶
If you've paid 30% effective federal tax rate (which is what I am guessing about right for a single individual with this kind of income) you'd have to make about 450K per year over 15 years to get to 2M in taxes. If you counted CA taxes then it drops your average income to 330K. My guess is that you are either miscalculating your taxes or misdescribing your experiences (overpriced housing in LA circa 2001 while making 330-450K for example does not quite make sense).
replies(1): >>30087050 #
18. justinclift ◴[26 Jan 22 15:07 UTC] No.30086367{5}[source]▶
> See Ukraine.

Didn't seem to help the Ukraine at all last time around. :/

replies(1): >>30091526 #
19. notch656a ◴[26 Jan 22 15:57 UTC] No.30087050{7}[source]▶
This person is so out of touch with reality, thinking 330k+ is barely out of "living under the bridge because of medical debt" territory, that for someone of fairly modest background like myself I may as well be talking to an alien. Yet they seem to legitimately think they narrowly escaped the rocks of poverty.
replies(1): >>30088534 #
20. pandaman ◴[26 Jan 22 17:27 UTC] No.30088534{8}[source]▶
Yeah, it's in 95% percentile even now, 20 years ago even $300K was extraordinary wealthy.
21. nexuist ◴[26 Jan 22 20:46 UTC] No.30091526{6}[source]▶
The only reason Ukraine still has a government right now is because of NATO forces on the border. I think it would be foolish to believe Putin would have stopped at Crimea had it not been for that. I pray that we do not go to war with Russia over this, but I also know that the Ukrainian people are counting on us to defend their freedom. It is tough all around.
22. dang ◴[27 Jan 22 20:23 UTC] No.30105957[source]▶
I don't normally scold the same user 4 times in one thread, but what you did here was so nasty and so shocking that I don't want anyone to run across a comment like this and not see it moderated.

If you post like this to HN again, we are going to have to ban you. Please read and follow the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. The quality of discussion we want here is at the opposite end of the pool.

23. dang ◴[27 Jan 22 20:25 UTC] No.30105990{3}[source]▶
Please do not feed flamewars on HN. This is in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

Edit: you posted a lot of other flamewar comments to this thread too. That's not ok, regardless of how bad other comments are or you feel they are. If you'd please review the site guidelines and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.