←back to thread

207 points jimhi | 9 comments | | HN request time: 1.209s | source | bottom
Show context
warning26 ◴[] No.29828947[source]
Really interesting article!

On a related note, one oddity I often see online (and, once, in person) are the die-hard groups of westerners who insist that North Korea is actually a paradise on earth and any claim to the contrary is some kind of evil capitalist propaganda. Utterly baffling, when there are so many sources like this article indicating otherwise.

replies(5): >>29829115 #>>29829500 #>>29829516 #>>29830736 #>>29830801 #
decafninja ◴[] No.29829115[source]
I've seen this too. Their mantra is usually something along the lines of "don't believe everything you see in the corrupt Western/South Korean media".

What gives?

I can understand different countries have different pros and cons, different people value different things, and something an American might find unpalatable might not be considered so bad somewhere else.

But North Korea seems to stand out as being one of very few countries that has no redeeming qualities whatsoever. Odd that anyone who wasn't born there would willingly and voluntarily pledge their allegiance to such a regime.

replies(2): >>29829297 #>>29829528 #
germandiago ◴[] No.29829528[source]
People tend to value different things. If you value hunger and corruption, go to Cuba or North Korea where you have to ask permission even to have the hair cut you want and some are illegal (NK in this case). Or you have to be treated like an animal in the customs to even make medicines or food in. I have seen this elsewhere, believe me. Those people that live from that deserve... I will not say what they deserve, but nothing good.

In the meantime, what happens is that the market is not and invention, but it "is". That is why there are black markets. And they are illegal. So what now? Easy: you have to brive all the public workers to get what you want. This is not only sad, this is attacking the dignity of the normal people who deserve a life.

replies(2): >>29829566 #>>29831037 #
1. MiroF ◴[] No.29829566[source]
> If you value hunger and corruption, go to Cuba or North Korea where you have to ask permission even to have the hair cut you want and some are illegal

Cuba does not have a major hunger problem at all and has a higher life expectancy than the US.

Lumping Cuba and North Korea together is silly & misguided.

replies(3): >>29829744 #>>29830183 #>>29830870 #
2. germandiago ◴[] No.29829744[source]
> Cuba does not have a major hunger problem at all and has a higher life expectancy than the US.

That is plainly false. There are lots of cheating in how they count that, for example, if a kid is going to have any kind of problem, they suggest and try to abort it and it does not appear in the count, to give you just one single example about how they count life expectation. There is lots more that is only make up, such as the health care myth and others.

They do have lots of doctors they send abroad and the regime gets 70% of their income. When you land abroad, if you work like that, they take away your passport so that you cannot escape. They do campaigns to donate blood and they sell that blood (over 21 million dollars in sales for blood that was supposed to be, most of it, an altruist action by cuban people in one year). They are literally treated as slaves.

Did you see what happened last July? There were riots in the streets. They did not have even medicines or food and they (the regime and its propaganda) started to talk about the embargo (incorrectly called blockage) as the problem, when the problem is that those people in that odious regime do not let even the food or medicines go through without taking a part.

I mean, they take advantage of the anguish of relatives that are outside and they smash them. After that I saw president Diaz Canel promoting violence against people for the protests from his very own words, not a translation or similar (I can speak spanish).

replies(1): >>29829906 #
3. ◴[] No.29829906[source]
4. germandiago ◴[] No.29830183[source]
> Lumping Cuba and North Korea together is silly & misguided.

They have basically the same system: more repression and strictness in North Korea. But same base: corruption, repression, intervention and treating their citizens as animals with no dignity.

5. fallingknife ◴[] No.29830870[source]
The life expectancy figures are manipulated: https://www.econlib.org/about-that-cuban-life-expectancy/
replies(1): >>29831283 #
6. MiroF ◴[] No.29831283[source]
I don't know that having a high abortion rate is "manipulation", they are of course going to have a high rate relative to the rest of Latin America. I cannot find a sourcing for the specific rate of abortion they cite.

The first "manipulation" identified would not impact Cuba's position as 1st in life expectancy in Latin America, as they concede in their article.

replies(2): >>29832750 #>>29833301 #
7. germandiago ◴[] No.29832750{3}[source]
Life in Cuba is miserable for the average person. It is not just life expectancy.
8. germandiago ◴[] No.29833301{3}[source]
> I don't know that having a high abortion rate is "manipulation"

It is because if you cannot take care of a kid with some kind of problem and dies young, it lowers the life expectancy. So they encourage abortion and remove it from the count.

replies(1): >>29835232 #
9. MiroF ◴[] No.29835232{4}[source]
Good?