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661 points pg | 8 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom

A surprisingly long time ago (2013 was a busy year) I mentioned a new plan to improve the quality of comments on Hacker News:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6009523

Since I'm going to check out of HN at the end of this YC cycle, this was my last chance to get this done. I didn't want the people who are going to inherit HN from me to have to build it as their first project, because it interacts with so many different bits of the code in such subtle ways.

So I found time to implement pending comments this past week, and with any luck it will launch tonight. Since it's a big change, I wanted to warn HN users in advance.

Here's how it currently works. From now on, when you post a comment, it won't initially be live. It will be in a new state called pending. Comments get from pending to live by being endorsed by multiple HN users with over 1000 karma. Those users will see pending comments, and will be able to endorse them by clicking on an "endorse" link next to the "flag" link.

Someone who has a pending comment will have to wait till it goes live to post another. We're hoping that good comments will get endorsed so quickly that there won't be a noticeable delay.

You can currently beat the system by posting an innocuous comment, waiting for it to be endorsed, and then after it's live, changing it to say something worse. We explicitly ask people not to do this. While we have no software for catching it, humans will notice, and we'll ban you.

Along with the change in software will come a change in policy. We're going to ask users with the ability to endorse comments only to endorse those that:

1. Say something substantial. E.g. not just a throwaway remark, or the kind of "Yes you did, No I didn't" bickering that races toward the right side of the page and no one cares about except the participants.

2. Say it without gratuitous nastiness. In particular, a comment in reply to another comment should be written in the spirit of colleagues cooperating in good faith to figure out the truth about something, not politicians trying to ridicule and misrepresent the other side.

People who regularly endorse comments that fail one or both of these tests will lose the ability to endorse comments. So if you're not sure whether you should endorse a comment, don't. There are a lot of people on HN. If a point is important, someone else will probably come along and make it without gratuitous nastiness.

I hope this will improve the quality of HN comments significantly, but we'll need your help to make it work, and your forbearance if, as usually happens, some things go wrong initially.

1. japhyr ◴[] No.7446344[source]
When I endorse a comment, does that also upvote the comment? Or is voting completely separate from endorsing?
replies(1): >>7446360 #
2. pg ◴[] No.7446360[source]
Separate. Endorsing just means you think a comment is substantial, not that you agree with it.
replies(3): >>7446437 #>>7446579 #>>7446639 #
3. rdl ◴[] No.7446437[source]
So one might endorse a substantial comment which is incorrect just so one can downvote it for being wrong.
replies(1): >>7446655 #
4. c23gooey ◴[] No.7446579[source]
And that is where this solution falls down. You are relying on a subset of people to ignore their human nature and endorse things they do not agree with.

Whilst I'll admit they maybe some who will do this, I believe the majority will just follow their instincts. This sort of behaviour can be seen in any internet forum.

Inevitably new posters are required to write posts they think will be endorsed in order to achieve the karma threshold needed to use the site properly

5. vacri ◴[] No.7446639[source]
Can you find a different term for it? To 'endorse' something means that you support it, and that you put your name behind that support. The action you're describing is more like 'publish' or 'pass' or 'authorise'. Probably 'release' is a good term, given the concept of 'pending'.
6. 6thSigma ◴[] No.7446655{3}[source]
I can't wait for the first "I endorsed this just so I can tell you how stupid you are" comment.
replies(1): >>7446899 #
7. rdl ◴[] No.7446899{4}[source]
You can tell someone they're wrong about something without 1) thinking that person is generally stupid 2) being mean, of course.

(e.g. if someone says "I think bitcoin is the first digital currency system which has attracted VC interest", I'd love it if someone from Flooz/Beanz (late-90s), or DigiCash (1980s-1990s) or various stored value systems would comment and say "Actually, ...")

replies(1): >>7447006 #
8. 6thSigma ◴[] No.7447006{5}[source]
Oh I know, but inevitably someone is going to use this endorse thing as a way to be incredibly condescending. Hopefully this system will then prevent that post to show, but I doubt it.