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Perl's decline was cultural

(www.beatworm.co.uk)
393 points todsacerdoti | 11 comments | | HN request time: 0.492s | source | bottom
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jordanb ◴[] No.46175337[source]
I always found the Perl "community" to be really off-putting with all the monk and wizard nonsense. Then there was the whole one-liner thing that was all about being clever and obscure. Everything about Python came off as being much more serious and normal for a young nerd who wasn't a theater kid.
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1. lysace ◴[] No.46175513[source]
Perl is a sysadmin language. There's "always" been this tension between sysadmins and developers.

In my mind (developer back then) I'd amateur-psychoanalyze all of that nonsense as some kind of inferiority complex meant to preserve the self image. Needless complexity can be a feature!

And now we are all developers!

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2. MrDarcy ◴[] No.46175535[source]
In the 2000’s Python was also a sysadmin language.

Edit: But I see your point, Google SRE’s around the late 2000’s reached for Python more than Perl.

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3. lysace ◴[] No.46175539[source]
(90s) Yes, but it developed.
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4. oncallthrow ◴[] No.46175916[source]
I think Perl is still more popular even today than Python as a sysadmin language. Late 2000s it certainly was. Maybe Google was different, but across the industry more widely Python was barely used, Perl was used everywhere.
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5. lysace ◴[] No.46175985{3}[source]
My experience:

Sysadmin-driven companies (typically Sun-based) often used Perl.

Developer-driven companies used other languages running on cheaper X86 Linux.

6. calmbonsai ◴[] No.46176135{3}[source]
As someone who lived through that transition, we used Perl extensively to sysadmin ~30 Solaris and Irix workstations and it was superlative at that.

At that time, Guido was still working at CNRI locally to us in Reston, VA and we had several discussions at the local Pyggies (Python User Group) on transitioning over to Python for that work. We were a (mostly) C++/Java shop, but Perl fit into all the other "crevices" beautifully.

Python just didn't have enough library support for all of our "swiss-army chainsaw" demands. Still, it was very apparent at the time it would eventually get there and I was enamored with its "one right way" of doing things--even at the bytecode level.

7. lo_zamoyski ◴[] No.46176256[source]
> some kind of inferiority complex meant to preserve the self image

Or, as the kids say, a flex, but without the sexy connotations.

(Incidentally, I am also reminded of a great quote attributed to Morphy:

"The ability to play chess is the sign of a gentleman. The ability to play chess well is the sign of a wasted life.")

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8. chihuahua ◴[] No.46176462[source]
That quote is not very convincing to me. Both parts of it are questionable.

Just being able to play chess is not a very high bar at all. Most 6-year-olds can learn it in an hour. Are the Chess hustlers at Washington Square Park all Gentlemen?

I don't see being able to play Chess well as any kind of deficiency. It could be that it's just someone's hobby. It doesn't have to mean they spiraled into madness, Bobby Fisher style.

(I can play chess, but not well, so I personally don't care about either half of that quote as it applies to me)

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9. hylaride ◴[] No.46182198{3}[source]
The quote, if originally from Morphy, is from the 1800s, though. So it's the context of the quote that matters.

Either way, it's not meant to be taken so literally!

10. astrange ◴[] No.46184348{3}[source]
Morphy, who is probably the greatest chess player to ever live, would probably know.
11. lesostep ◴[] No.46190957[source]
I think it's a sysadmin thing to have a little bit more wimsy in the code.

Administrative work by nature leaves you a bit bored, if you do it right. So you sometimes pick something up just to play with.

I can't speak about every sysad experience, but in mine a lot of scripts tend to be in a "make once, remember for ten years" category, and even a bit of creative naming can help a long way.

Working with a larger codebase with "creative" code, on the other hand, is frustrating. And if you don't have to write code, you might as well go take a walk, "monitoring" isn't in your job description.