←back to thread

1041 points mpweiher | 4 comments | | HN request time: 0.79s | source
Show context
m101 ◴[] No.45230060[source]
I think a good exercise for the reader is to reflect on why they were ever against nuclear power in the first place. Nuclear power was always the greenest, most climate friendly, safest, cheapest (save for what we do to ourselves), most energy dense, most long lasting, option.
replies(25): >>45230185 #>>45230223 #>>45230479 #>>45230658 #>>45230757 #>>45231144 #>>45231518 #>>45231738 #>>45232518 #>>45232615 #>>45232756 #>>45232757 #>>45232937 #>>45233169 #>>45233513 #>>45233762 #>>45233817 #>>45233825 #>>45234181 #>>45234637 #>>45234828 #>>45235394 #>>45238856 #>>45240108 #>>45243016 #
teamonkey ◴[] No.45231738[source]
> I think a good exercise for the reader is to reflect on why they were ever against nuclear power in the first place.

The context is a long string of nuclear incidents throughout the Cold War through to the ‘90s.

Not just Chernobyl, not just Fukushima, but the string of disasters at Windscale / Sellafield and many others across the globe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_power_accident...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_and_radiation_...

These disasters were huge, newsworthy and alarmingly regular. People read about those getting sick and dying directly as a result. They felt the cleanup costs as taxpayers. They saw how land became unusable after a large event, and, especially terrifying for those who had lived as adults through Cold War, saw the radioactive fallout blown across international borders by the wind.

It’s not Greenpeace or an anti-nuclear lobby who caused the widespread public reaction to nuclear. It was the public reaction seeing it with their own eyes, and making an understandable decision that they didn’t like the risks.

Chernobyl was one hammer blow to the coffin lid, Fukushima the second, but nuclear power was already half-dead before either of those events, kept alive only by unpopular political necessity.

I’m not even anti-nuclear myself, but let’s be clear: the worldwide nuclear energy industry is itself to blame for the lack of faith in nuclear energy.

replies(4): >>45232323 #>>45232361 #>>45247298 #>>45247935 #
gilbetron ◴[] No.45232361[source]
And yet if you look at the "Fatalities" column, you see a stream of zeroes with a handful of non-zeroes, the worst being Chernobyl at 50 direct fatalities. Rooftop solar accounts for more deaths.

Nuke plants are scary when they fail, but the actual threat is way lower than we play it out to be.

replies(7): >>45232520 #>>45232777 #>>45232788 #>>45233204 #>>45233484 #>>45233871 #>>45235368 #
1. teamonkey ◴[] No.45232788[source]
Yes, that’s my point. They are scary - memorably so - in a way that very few other forms of power generation are. The closest equivalent I can think of is a major hydroelectric dam breaking.

Also remember that at each major incident, despite the failures that led to it, people fought tirelessly, in several cases sacrificing themselves, to reduce the scope of the disaster. Each of them could have potentially been worse. We are lucky in that the worst case death figures have not been added to the statistics.

replies(1): >>45236523 #
2. seec ◴[] No.45236523[source]
Yes that's the point. Dam failure is much worse and actually the largest event of fatalities related to power generation was a dam breaking. Yet people are not against dams at all, even though they are not much better in terms of risks.

It's entirely irrational just like people who are scared of flying.

replies(2): >>45238691 #>>45239652 #
3. ViewTrick1002 ◴[] No.45238691[source]
I think this line of thinking comes from a westernized world where all water is controlled.

Many dams have been built around the world not for power generation, but to control flooding. The power generation is a secondary concern.

In aggregate dams have saved far more lives, by managing flood waters.

The great thing in 2025 is that we don’t need either the dam or nuclear risk for our electricity needs.

Just build renewables and storage and the risk for the general public is as close to zero as we can get. The only people involved in accidents are those that chose to work in the industry installing and maintaining the gear.

We should of course continue to focus on work place safety but for the general public the risk of a life changing evacuation, radiation exposure or flood from dam failure does not exist.

4. teamonkey ◴[] No.45239652[source]
Irrational, perhaps, but also totally understandable and unlikely to change.

People fly but it requires a huge amount of trust to put yourself in someone’s hands like that, where if something goes wrong the results are catastrophic. People have faith in the regulations, they trust that the pilots are well-trained and the planes well-maintained, to the point where the chances of catastrophe are so small it overcomes their natural fears.

The same is true of the nuclear industry. The only thing making nuclear a remotely popular option is the extensive regulation which makes the risk to the consumer so small it outweighs their fears.

And the trouble is that it is up against solar and wind, where the cost is much smaller, and the absolute risk - if you discount people who choose to working to install them - really is very close to 0.