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548 points kmelve | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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spicyusername ◴[] No.45114584[source]
I guess we're just going to be in the age of this conversation topic until everyone gets tired of talking about it.

Every one of these discussions boils down to the following:

- LLMs are not good at writing code on their own unless it's extremely simple or boilerplate

- LLMs can be good at helping you debug existing code

- LLMs can be good at brainstorming solutions to new problems

- The code that is written by LLMs always needs to be heavily monitored for correctness, style, and design, and then typically edited down, often to at least half its original size

- LLMs utility is high enough that it is now going to be a standard tool in the toolbox of every software engineer, but it is definitely not replacing anyone at current capability.

- New software engineers are going to suffer the most because they know how to edit the responses the least, but this was true when they wrote their own code with stack overflow.

- At senior level, sometimes using LLMs is going to save you a ton of time and sometimes it's going to waste your time. Net-net, it's probably positive, but there are definitely some horrible days where you spend too long going back and forth, when you should have just tried to solve the problem yourself.

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chamomeal ◴[] No.45115041[source]
Yeah every time I see one of these articles posted on HN I know I'll see a bunch of comments like "well here's how I use claude code: I keep it on a tight leash and have short feedback loops, so that I'm still the driver, and have markdown files that explain the style I'm going for...". Which is fine lol but I'm tired of seeing the exact same conversations.

It's exhausting to hear about AI all the time but it's fun to watch history happen. In a decade we'll look back at all these convos and remember how wild of a time it was to be a programmer.

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coldpie ◴[] No.45115721[source]
I'm thiiiis close to writing a Firefox extension that auto-hides any HN headline with an LLM/AI-related keyword in the title, just so I can find something interesting on here again.
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codyb ◴[] No.45116156[source]
It comes and goes in cycles... I remember the hay days of MVC frameworks and oh my this one is MVVC! ad nauseum for... years lol.

I stopped coming here for a year or two, now I visit once a day or so and mostly just skim a couple threads.

Eventually, this entire field... just starts to feel pretty cyclical.

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1. oblio ◴[] No.45119906{3}[source]
Keep in mind that the cycles here are not circles, they're spirals. We <<are>> progressing, it's just very slow to notice.

A bit of proof: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/08/09/the-joel-test-12-s...

1. Do you use source control? - I haven't seen a software company without source control in... 2 decades?

2. Can you make a build in one step? - This is a bit tricky, but it super widespread. Maybe not universal, but very widespread.

3. Do you make daily builds? - Same as #2.

4. Do you have a bug database? - Same as #2.

5. Do you fix bugs before writing new code? - This is a debatable topic but you could argue that modern bugs are more complex and we are fixing them.

6. Do you have an up-to-date schedule? - Heh, some things you just can't win :-p

7. Do you have a spec? - Similar to #6.

8. Do programmers have quiet working conditions? - This one is the biggest modern failure, but it's not one of tech.

9. Do you use the best tools money can buy? - Similar to #2.

10. Do you have testers? - We've moved to automated testing. We've lost some flair but we've gained a lot in day-to-day quality.

11. Do new candidates write code during their interview? - Really widespread now, but not universal. Less widespread than having proper build systems.

12. Do you do hallway usability testing? - Varies a lot by field, it used to vary even back in the day.