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Tesla said it didn't have key data in a fatal crash, then a hacker found it

(www.washingtonpost.com)
650 points clcaev | 2 comments | 29 Aug 25 11:15 UTC | HN request time: 0s | source
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fabian2k ◴[29 Aug 25 12:38 UTC] No.45063298[source]▶
Do I understand it correctly? Crash data gets automatically transmitted to Tesla, and after it was transmitted is immediately marked for deletion?

If that is actually designed like this, the only reason I could see for it would be so that Tesla has sole access to the data and can decide whether to use it or not. Which really should not work in court, but it seems it has so far.

And of course I'd expect an audit trail for the deletion of crash data on Tesla servers. But who knows whether there actually isn't one, or nobody looked into it at all.

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ChrisMarshallNY ◴[29 Aug 25 14:23 UTC] No.45064532[source]▶
It's probably a bit like "This call may be recorded for quality purposes." That's a disclaimer that's usually required by the authorities, to let you know that you're being recorded, but it lets them off the hook, if the recording would be inconvenient to them. If it supports their side, they 100% always have it, but if it supports the caller's side, then it seems they didn't actually record that call ...so sorry...

Tesla's fairly notorious for casual treatment of customer car data (which they have a lot of). There was an article, recently, about how in-car video recordings were being passed around the office.

I know that at least one porn actress recorded a scene in a self-driving Tesla. I'll bet that recording made the rounds "for quality purposes."

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criddell ◴[29 Aug 25 14:35 UTC] No.45064690[source]▶
> "This call may be recorded for quality purposes."

It's a disclaimer, but it also grants permission for you to record.

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ChrisMarshallNY ◴[29 Aug 25 14:45 UTC] No.45064830[source]▶
This is true.

I knew a guy who used to record all his calls with companies, and would let them know they were being recorded, if they didn't have that disclaimer.

He would say "This call is being recorded." He told me that most of the companies hung up immediately, when he said that.

I never heard him say that his recording ever did him any good, though.

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1. Aurornis ◴[29 Aug 25 16:01 UTC] No.45065808[source]▶
> He would say "This call is being recorded." He told me that most of the companies hung up immediately, when he said that.

If someone calls you and declares that they're recording the conversation, you probably should hang up too. It's usually used as a threat by people who intend to use it against you legally somehow. Your friend may have been an exception, but there's no way for the people on the other end to know either.

If you're acting as a representative of a company on the phone, hanging up and informing your manager or legal counsel is a good idea.

As for customer service recording calls: I didn't understand this until I was on the other side of customer support. The number of people who tell lies about interactions with support is insane. These days it's mostly e-mail and therefore easy to look up. You wouldn't believe how many people would try to throw our customer support people under the bus ("Support said you'd give me a free replacement!") until they realize we can go back and check these things.

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2. dghlsakjg ◴[29 Aug 25 16:23 UTC] No.45066099[source]▶
The majority (37!) of states do not require consent or notification, and there is no federal requirement (so as long as the recorder is in a one party state, the recording is legal). There is also no requirement that a person let you know that a third party is on their side of the line listening, taking notes and willing to testify.

You should just assume that any phone call with stakes is being recorded and that anything you say can be considered binding. Verbal contracts are valid almost everywhere, so what you say on the phone does have legal consequences regardless of whether it was recorded. Courts will also accept your notes about a phone call as evidence in the absence of a recording.