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I Am An AI Hater

(anthonymoser.github.io)
443 points BallsInIt | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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Mallowram[dead post] ◴[] No.45044328[source]
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lo_zamoyski ◴[] No.45044583[source]
> Words are the most indirect form of perception imaginable. Both Aristotle and Cassirer knew this

What?

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Mallowram ◴[] No.45044673[source]
Aristotle: There are no contradictions.

Cassirer: “Only when we put away words will be able to reach the initial conditions, only then will we have direct perception. All linguistic denotation is essentially ambiguous–and in this ambiguity, this “paronymia” of words is the source of all myths…this self-deception is rooted in language, which is forever making a game of the human mind, ever ensnaring it in that iridescent play of meanings…even theoretical knowledge becomes phantasmagoria; for even knowledge can never reproduce the true nature of things as they are but must frame their essence in “concepts.” Consequently all schemata which science evolves in order to classify, organize and summarize the phenomena of the real, turns out to be nothing but arbitrary schemes. So knowledge, as well as myth, language, and art, has been reduced to a kind of fiction–a fiction that recommends its usefulness, but must not be measured by any strict standard of truth, if it is not to melt away into nothingness.” Cassirer Language and Myth

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lo_zamoyski ◴[] No.45046556[source]
> Aristotle: There are no contradictions.

I still don't know what this is supposed to mean, and I am not unfamiliar with Aristotle.

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Mallowram ◴[] No.45047358[source]
If you don't grasp the basic ideas of paradox questioning the nature of language beginning in presocratics and winding their way through Aristotle, Socrates, Kant Hume and many others and also appearing in Advaita Vedanta (eg Nisargadatta), then I'm afraid staring here isn't really going to help you. Philosophy has ben questioning whether language is valid from the start. https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/aristotle-noncontradictio...
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lo_zamoyski ◴[] No.45052262[source]
You're being evasive and hiding behind jargon and frankly, nonsensical phrases. As I said, I am not unfamiliar with Aristotle, so don't be shy about making clear and direct claims. If you can't do that, then, I'm sorry, but this some kind is bullshit.

(FWIW, a feature of the Aristotelian logical tradition is that, unlike the modern, Fregean tradition which is indifferent about the relationship between logic and language, it is very much concerned by the logical structures within grammar. From a practical point of view, this makes total sense: we want to be able to evaluate arguments, to clarify arguments, and so on, which are generally given in natural language. Aristotle was also a moderate realist. Language is a reflection of reality.)

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1. Mallowram ◴[] No.45052574[source]
The clearest direct claim is if there are no contradictions then language is impossible.

Language is not a "reflection of reality" in any way shape or form: reality is always specific, language is always arbitrary.

We're currently in a neurodynamic/neurobiological overthrow of psychodynamic principles that obviates in presocrats onwards.

The fact is language has nothing really to do with reality and has only to do with subjective biases that arbitrarily perform gibberish in the stead of status-gain, control, etc (pick any primate bias that Aristotle onwards was unconscious to).

“We refute (based on empirical evidence) claims that humans use linguistic representations to think.” Ev Fedorenko Language Lab MIT 2024