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Altered states of consciousness induced by breathwork accompanied by music

(journals.plos.org)
557 points gnabgib | 7 comments | 28 Aug 25 00:22 UTC | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom
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brandall10 ◴[28 Aug 25 02:45 UTC] No.45047771[source]▶
FWIW, I used to use a light and sound machine (Mindplace Procyon) and was able to induce these states with minimal effort. And I had a couple dozen experiences w/ psilocybin in my college years, so I'm well versed in what they should be like.

The goggles w/ binaural beats create some weird sort of state where I don't feel any connection to my environment. After only a couple minutes my body turns to total mush and my brain comes alive with phosphene visuals. By about 15 minutes in, my stomach usually gurgles a bit, not unlike the indigestion that often accompanies psychedelic trips.

Interestingly enough, these machines are marketed as brainwave entrainment, but the literature on that says the visual component doesn't really have much impact. Yet auditory entrainment on its own doesn't seem to do much for me either, or at least, not convincing enough beyond placebo.

There is an app for the iPhone called Lumenate that uses the LED flash and it seems to work, though it's not as strong for me as the multi-LED goggles I used to use. Still, it's a great gateway for those who are curious.

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1. vanderZwan ◴[28 Aug 25 09:23 UTC] No.45050131[source]▶
Did you try the light and sound machine before trying psilocybin? Not to discount your experience - it is valuable that you can compare your experiences and confirm similarity, but if you did then we cannot rule out that your previous experience with psilocybin makes it easier to reach those states again with a light and sound machine.

I guess if we'd want to know for sure we'd need to test the light and sound technique with people who haven't used psilocybin before, then let them try psilocybin so they can compare the experience, and then let them try the light and sound machine again to see if anything changed in how "suggestive" they are to the experience. And compare against a light-and-sound machine only control group. I doubt we'll see that happen any time soon though.

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2. hattmall ◴[28 Aug 25 11:52 UTC] No.45051044[source]▶
Yeah, I'm sure having previously done psilocybin is a pre-requisite. I could never imagine that someone only using light and sound who then takes psilocybin would rate the experiences similarly. Alternatively, I can (involuntarily) re-experience psylocibin just by being overly tired in a particular setting at times, it's not pleasant.
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3. Gud ◴[28 Aug 25 12:01 UTC] No.45051107[source]▶
Why are you so sure?
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4. hattmall ◴[28 Aug 25 12:27 UTC] No.45051336{3}[source]▶
There's quite a few non-drug things that can induce an altered state of consciousness like Bungee jumping, hunting, practically any extremely intense activity. Any situation where you truly believe you have a legitimate feeling of facing death essentially activates the ASC. Which is to say consciousness becomes secondary to your body's actions and you experience that separation. You feel your mind and body are two completely different entities and in that ASC your mind is the observer of your body the actor. Essentially everything that is happening in the physical world is being controlled by your subconscience and all the brain power used for normally interacting and decision making is separated and observant.

I have no doubt it's possible to activate this through breath work and various means like religious experiences etc, I've done so myself. A strong psylocbin induced separation is far more intense by an almost incomprehensible order of magnitude.

For an example, let's say you induce a, for lack of a better term, trip from breath work. At no point is it going to get so intense that every aspect of your body and conscience forgets that you are doing the breathwork and you are unable to stop even when prompted by people such as EMT's and police. Physically ending the breathwork will bring the separation back. With Pyscolbin that's not true and the intensity only builds and you could be in this state of unrecoverable separation for 8+ hours. In the reverse, the deep feelings and insight from Psylocbin come in that decline after the peak where everything starts to become real again and your recognition of the world returns and you remember you ate mushrooms.

After that though it's quite reasonable to get that same feeling from any altered state of consciousness.

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5. skeezyboy ◴[28 Aug 25 14:15 UTC] No.45052446[source]▶
> I can (involuntarily) re-experience psylocibin just by being overly tired in a particular setting at times

do you get it particulary when you lie down or put your feet up?

6. brandall10 ◴[28 Aug 25 15:07 UTC] No.45053144[source]▶
That is a valid point, I already had significant experience with the drug when I purchased one.

That said, I was still shocked at how quickly and effectively it worked the first I used it and how reliably it worked despite whatever state I was in. No amount of meditation or breathing techniques have gotten me close, and I've never had a natural flashback.

7. brandall10 ◴[28 Aug 25 16:39 UTC] No.45054224{4}[source]▶
Just to be clear, I'm comparing it to the linked research and any notions of naturally induced states.

To me, it's similar to that early part of the trip where you get tired and feel like you want to take a nap, only to find that impossible upon closing your eyes and seeing the images dance around. Eventually that part of the trip ends as the energy builds.