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360 points danielmorozoff | 5 comments | | HN request time: 0.675s | source
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NitpickLawyer ◴[] No.45002721[source]
There is a great podcast with the entire team + Noland on yt. It is ~ 8h long, but IMO it's worth the time. You get to hear things from the perspective of the chief brain surgeon, hardware team, software team, and of course Noland himself. I really recommend it, to get a better understanding of what's possible, what they had to do to get there, and how impactful this kind of research is for people with terrible conditions.
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Veserv ◴[] No.45032352[source]
Still the same depraved head of neurosurgery, Dr. Matthew MacDougall, who said: "If tomorrow laws were changed and the FDA said okay you can do some of this early experimentation in willing human participants that would be a very interesting option I think there would be a lot of people that would step up." [1]

That is basically the textbook definition of unethical medical practice, so unquestionably far over the line of acceptable practice that you would have to be willfully ignorant to defend it, and they think it would be exciting if it were not banned.

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZGItIAUQmI&t=5239s

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1. dvt ◴[] No.45032718[source]
> That is basically the textbook definition of unethical medical practice

This is an extremely uncharitable interpretation of what was said. First of all, it's really hard to get malpractice here, as consent is implied (unless you'd think he'd purposefully do a bad or sloppy job). You could say it's irresponsible, and that argument holds more water, but when folks are in these terrible situations (i.e. terminally ill, etc.), a strong argument could also be that it's morally impermissible to disallow them to partake in such experimental treatments.

In any case, it's an interesting moral conundrum, akin to abortion or euthanasia.

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2. michaelmrose ◴[] No.45034141[source]
Being blind or disabled isn't anything like dying of cancer.

We allow compassionate testing of therapies that might allow you to live longer because the alternative is an ugly death.

Consent is never ever ever implied and you don't have to deliberately do a poor job to be liable.

Just not having good evidence of the therapy is liable to improve their lot and doing it anyway or failing to impart an accurate picture of the risks because you don't know enough to do so.

How can you possibly have informed consent without the same info that you hope to glean?

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3. JumpCrisscross ◴[] No.45036586[source]
> Being blind or disabled isn't anything like dying of cancer

I think it’s presumptuous to conclude from afar where someone’s affliction lies on a scale of suffering.

People should be free to do with their bodies what they choose. To describe and act on their subjective experience of themselves as they see fit, not as a third party deems they ought to.

4. Xorakios ◴[] No.45037127[source]
But how you glean info without volunteers consenting to take a risk in hope of improving their lot?
5. try_the_bass ◴[] No.45039889[source]
> We allow compassionate testing of therapies that might allow you to live longer because the alternative is an ugly death.

Calling many of these therapies "compassionate" is a bit of a stretch after you learn about their side effects...