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693 points macawfish | 5 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source
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al_borland ◴[] No.44544145[source]
All these ID check laws are out of hand. Parents are expecting the government, and random websites, to raise their kids. Why would anyone trust some random blog with their ID?

If these laws move forward (and I don’t think they should), there needs to be a way to authenticate as over 18 without sending picture of your ID off to random 3rd parties, or giving actual personal details. I don’t want to give this data, and websites shouldn’t want to shoulder the responsibility for it.

It seems like this could work much like Apple Pay, just without the payment. A prompt comes up, I use some biometric authentication on my phone, and it sends a signal to the browser that I’m 18+. Apple has been adding state IDs into the Wallet, this seems like it could fall right in line. The same thing could be used for buying alcohol at U-Scan checkout.

People should also be able to set their browser/computer to auto-send this for single-user devices, where it is all transparent to the user. I don’t have kids and no one else’s uses my devices. Why should I need to jump through hoops?

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VBprogrammer ◴[] No.44545322[source]
The slippery slope from here to banning under 18s looking at websites discussing suicidal thoughts, transgender issues, homosexually and onto anything some group of middle age mothers decide isn't appropriate seems dangerously anti-fallacitical.
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cmilton ◴[] No.44545647[source]
While I completely understand the slippery slope concept, we ban all kinds of things for under 18s based on morals. Why couldn't these be any different? How else does a society decide as a whole what they are for or against. Obviously, there should be limits.
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afavour ◴[] No.44545805[source]
The question is always “whose morals”. I think society as a whole is in agreement that minors are better off without access to pornography, for example. But the arrangement OP is outlining is one where a minority are able to force their morality on a broader population that doesn’t agree with it.
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lelanthran ◴[] No.44545909[source]
You might be wrong there. While the majority does not oppose homosexual relationships they are against affirmative transgender treatments for minors.
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LexiMax ◴[] No.44546539[source]
> transgender treatments

The grandparent post didn't say "transgender treatments" they said "transgender issues."

Do you believe that the mere concept of questioning your gender identity or expression is something that should be kept from the minds of minors?

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lelanthran ◴[] No.44546749[source]
> The grandparent post didn't say "transgender treatments" they said "transgender issues."

You don't think that transgender treatments is a transgender issue? If you think it is then my response is perfectly on-topic.

> Do you believe that the mere concept of questioning your gender identity or expression is something that should be kept from the minds of minors?

Depending on your jurisdiction, there are messages you can't target to kids. Why should there be a special exemption for this?

Besides, my belief on this is irrelevant; the only transgender issue that has gotten pushback en-masse from the clear majority of people world wide has been transgender treatments on minors.

IOW, this (treatment for persons unable to give informed consent) is a very unpopular position.

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LexiMax ◴[] No.44546861{6}[source]
> Depending on your jurisdiction, there are messages you can't target to kids. Why should there be a special exemption for this?

Because the idea that the only acceptable gender norms a kid is allowed to be exposed to and express is the one tied to their genes is frankly a ridiculous concept.

There's nothing wrong with boys wearing dresses and playing with dolls. If you don't believe that harmless message should reach the ears of kids, then why? What is in that sort of message that you're afraid of?

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bluefirebrand ◴[] No.44546997{7}[source]
> There's nothing wrong with boys wearing dresses and playing with dolls. If you don't believe that harmless message should reach the ears of kids, then why?

I fully agree there's nothing wrong with boys wearing dresses and playing with dolls

I think the idea that a boy wearing dresses and playing with dolls must automatically be trans is actually very harmful and I do oppose that message reaching anyone

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LexiMax[dead post] ◴[] No.44547109{8}[source]
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1. bluefirebrand ◴[] No.44547579{9}[source]
> Do you believe that the mere concept of questioning your gender identity or expression is something that should be kept from the minds of minors?

Not at all

I just think that the clothes you choose to wear shouldn't have anything to do with gender identity

They may be related because it might relate to how you choose to express your gender

But the fact is that clothes are clothes, not genders

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2. LexiMax ◴[] No.44547703[source]
> Not at all

Then ultimately you and I agree on the main crux of this conversation, the part that actually matters.

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3. bluefirebrand ◴[] No.44562521[source]
I don't think we do

I'm vehemently against the "transing" of anyone who exhibits behavior or preferences that are outside of cultural norms for their biological sex

They might be trans, yes. But they might not. I'm very very very against putting people in the trans category when they shouldn't be

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4. LexiMax ◴[] No.44567754{3}[source]
Again, gender identity and gender expression is something that is up to the individual. You don't label someone as trans, you ask them how they identify, just as if you were asking what name they go by.

You and I are on the exact same page. If you still don't think so, please make the distinction clear.

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5. ◴[] No.44572011{4}[source]