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539 points drankl | 74 comments | | HN request time: 1.477s | source | bottom
1. hresvelgr ◴[] No.44485587[source]
The lovable aphorisms we had for people with character quirks were largely from our original support systems. What no one is talking about is the reason therapy-talk has become so pervasive is because all those support systems: family, friends, and local communities (religious or otherwise), have all degraded so severely for most that therapy is the only option for reaching out and getting help.
replies(7): >>44485680 #>>44485696 #>>44485993 #>>44486061 #>>44486232 #>>44486247 #>>44518150 #
2. ◴[] No.44485680[source]
3. deanCommie ◴[] No.44485696[source]
except they weren't really "support systems"

i mean they were, if you got lucky.

If you were neurotypical; if you bought in to the local religious sect's particular flavour and embraced it wholeheartedly; if you followed the other local cults of sports fandoms; if you were lucky enough to either have family without their own trauma that didn't take it out on you OR decided to repress it in exactly the same way that they did and just simply passed it forward or didn't talk about it.

i don't know what the ratios are but a LOT of people fell through the cracks.

it's just that the birth rate was high enough to continue the population growth, and there were socially acceptable ways to ignore the inconvenient problems (see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosemary_Kennedy)

it's why there's now suddenly an influx of ADHD and Autism diagnosis - because in the past anyone outside of the norm who wasn't lucky to do one of the things above was simply ignored, beaten, or died.

now the stigma is gone and we're finding EXPLICIT paths to treatment, tolerance, and embracement of mental health, neuroatypical brains, spectrums, etc. Is there overpathologizing? Maybe? Hard to know! The stigmas still aren't gone. Go read the comments on any video providing tips on how to parent children on the spectrum and see neurotypicals freaking out about how soft the current generation is.

the western world seems to have peaked in tolerance in the 2010s, and is now backsliding into authoritarianism and fascism. that's trying to recreate a lot of those original support systems (by destroying the new ones). It's a bold plan, let's see how it happens.

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4. EMIRELADERO ◴[] No.44485785[source]
I agree with everything you said except for the last paragraph.

The people who, according to your theory, want to reverse the tolerance trend and slide towards fascism/authoritarianism didn't pop out today. They existed and lived in society in the 2010s too. So, from a logical standpoint, what changed?

replies(4): >>44485850 #>>44486009 #>>44487143 #>>44489483 #
5. MichaelZuo ◴[] No.44485806[source]
Isn’t the first half a tautology?

By definition roughly half the population in any society must belong to a below average family and/or below average communities.

And it seems pretty likely that those with below average capacities at handling, processing, reflecting, etc., on these issues would be concentrated there.

6. WorkerBee28474 ◴[] No.44485813[source]
> it's why there's now suddenly an influx of ADHD and Autism diagnosis - because in the past anyone outside of the norm who wasn't lucky to do one of the things above was simply ignored, beaten, or died.

I think you're understating how well those people were incorporated into society. My grandfather was born in the 20s and was described as quite "high strung", was amazing with technology, would repair anything, and even used to build his own farm machinery. These days he'd definitely be called severely anxious, and probably labelled as being on the spectrum. Yet he was part of a community, farmed his whole life, and built a family. People knew his quirks and compensated for them.

replies(4): >>44485890 #>>44486380 #>>44487101 #>>44489831 #
7. chairmansteve ◴[] No.44485850{3}[source]
> what changed?

The algorithms are promoting those views?

8. Tijdreiziger ◴[] No.44485890{3}[source]
Sorry, but are you arguing that autistic folks can’t be part of a community, farm, or build a family?
replies(1): >>44486035 #
9. typewithrhythm ◴[] No.44485953[source]
There is substantially more going on than "tolerance vs intolerance". We have a huge influx not just because of changing diagnosis standards, but also because the financial benefit for getting a diagnosis has also expanded.

The views of people you are trying to label as fascist are more accurately described as individualism vs welfare state.

replies(3): >>44486186 #>>44486199 #>>44486226 #
10. Aurornis ◴[] No.44485993[source]
I don’t see these as opposing ends of a spectrum. I think they’re largely independent variables.

Anecdotally, the people I know who have become most immersed in therapy speak are also the most socially connected. The therapy speak and associated language have become tools for establishing themselves within their social support system, communicating cries for help, and even trying to use therapy terms to shield themselves from accountability for their actions by transforming it into a therapy session.

11. BriggyDwiggs42 ◴[] No.44486009{3}[source]
The parent comment didn’t even pose a theory as to why. People can change beliefs over time. Weimar Germany had less Nazis in it than Nazi Germany, which would be equally confusing under your framing.
12. geerlingguy ◴[] No.44486035{4}[source]
I saw it as arguing that people with autism, ADHD, etc wouldn't be ignored, beaten, or killed, as seemed to be the argument in the parent comment?
replies(2): >>44486216 #>>44486250 #
13. Paracompact ◴[] No.44486061[source]
I agree, though possibly for different reasons. Those support systems may or may not be weaker than they were in generations past, but they are certainly more likely to say "I can't help you, go get professional help" than in the past.

In some ways this is a good thing. It is good if bipolar people get the medication they need faster, and can start living their best lives. But as someone who almost died to depression, the "help" out there is criminal. It is not a disease we have a cure for, in fact it's not clear to me it's even a disease in most sufferers, but a healthy and rational response to societal decay. I do not believe some disorders will ever be satisfactorily explained by individual-centric medicine, in the same way history will never be satisfactorily explained by great man theory.

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14. wredcoll ◴[] No.44486186{3}[source]
Ahh.. indiviualism, is that the one where you shouldn't have to help anyone else as long as things are going fine for yourself?
replies(2): >>44486243 #>>44486369 #
15. stevenAthompson ◴[] No.44486199{3}[source]
What financial benefit would a diagnosis have?
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16. Mtinie ◴[] No.44486216{5}[source]
One anecdotal observation does not fully tell the story.
17. Mtinie ◴[] No.44486226{3}[source]
I can assure you that from my singular anecdotal experience that a diagnosis does not imbue economic and financial benefit.
replies(1): >>44486270 #
18. theusus ◴[] No.44486232[source]
> is because all those support systems: family, friends, and local communities (religious or otherwise), have all degraded so severely.

I disagree! There was never a good support system at all. We used to just man up and live with it. Now that stress is reaching it's new heights. We can't cope with it.

replies(1): >>44486333 #
19. stevenAthompson ◴[] No.44486243{4}[source]
Ayn Rand has a lot of friends here. She also described the neurodivergent as "subnormal" and thought that society should do nothing to help them or the handicapped. Additionally, she believed that "normal" children shouldn't have to ever interact with those who were mentally different as it would harm the "normal" children.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1HD8KXn-kI

20. dpkirchner ◴[] No.44486247[source]
It was also possible to buy afford a house and a small family on a job that doesn't require much training or special skills. It's easier to deal with (often meaning "ignore") undiagnosed mental issues with your own roof over your head.
21. Tijdreiziger ◴[] No.44486250{5}[source]
Ah, I see. I think the ‘label’ (ugh – what a terribly awful way to describe a diagnosis) and the beatings are orthogonal, though.

In my parents’ time in a (then) Dutch colony, nobody was diagnosed with anything (that was only for crazies), but all the men knew how being hit with a belt felt (daughters were spared, from what I’ve been told). Self-medicating with alcohol and beating your kids if they ‘misbehaved’ was just the done thing, as far as I’ve been told.

This is to say that anyone who showed (what we would now identify as) neurodivergent behaviour probably would’ve been beaten, but this then wouldn’t have precluded them from going on to start a family and business (and maybe beat their own kids).

Actually, this is probably still how it works in many parts of the world. Even here in the Netherlands, beating your children was only outlawed as recently as 2007.

22. Spivak ◴[] No.44486270{4}[source]
I can second the assertion. It's absurd that people really believe folks are getting benefits from having a mental disorder. It's literally the "welfare queen" nonsense just directed at a new group.

You don't even get social benefits, no one excuses your behavior just because it has a label. You get told it's your fault for not managing your disorder properly. Have you seen how we treat people with visible, obvious, undeniable disabilities? Like shit.

replies(1): >>44494050 #
23. jazzyjackson ◴[] No.44486333[source]
I'm very curious as to how you come to the conclusion that 'stress' has increased. I don't suppose it's that the world is more stressful, WWII, cold war, a thousand famines throughout history, what makes us so stressed that we can't cope in some way that we used to be able to cope?
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24. typewithrhythm ◴[] No.44486342{4}[source]
Depending on the specific services in an area: everything from subsidised legal access to medications, to access to accommodations in schools seen as favorable (private environments to take tests, or extended deadlines). Some areas have specific assistance to parents of children with a diagnosis. Some have easier access to disability support services and payments.
replies(1): >>44487116 #
25. typewithrhythm ◴[] No.44486369{4}[source]
You can call it selfish, but you can't call it fascist.

In my perspective, it's less about what you should or shouldn't do; its about making sure that question is down to your individual morality.

26. deanCommie ◴[] No.44486380{3}[source]
no i don't think we're saying different things.

what you're describing is survivor's bias.

1) the most talented people with cognitive differences made it out for sure. But not every person on the spectrum is "amazing with technology" in a useful way. But not all are, and the ones that weren't just didn't make it. Today they do.

2) those people still needed luck. Luck that they were able to come up in a society that didn't expect more from them than to perform a "function". Things like meeting a spouse were "easier" because there was a more rigorous social structure. Depending on which society this was in, potentially to the detriment of your grandmother who didn't have a lot of choices.

2b) and luck that the community around them accepted them. That wasn't JUST because he was a farmer, it's also because he hit the other markers of inclusion whether he wanted to or not.

People in that day and age were not cognitively free. Is cognitive freedom preferable? Well that's the question of our age. We weren't supposed to just kill god and stop. We were supposed to replace a new humanist secular philosophy to replace the theology to find purpose to humanity.

We didn't, society is now full of anxiety and malaise, and the right wing is rising promising to fix it by a RVTRN to the old ways regardless of who they harm.

27. drewcoo ◴[] No.44486501[source]
> It's why there's now suddenly an influx of ADHD and Autism diagnosis

I claim the DSM-5 is why. We changed diagnostic criteria then we diagnosed. People who used to be "normal" were suddenly "undiagnosed until late in life." But the people themselves hadn't changed much, just the diagnostic criteria.

replies(1): >>44488018 #
28. mcdeltat ◴[] No.44486572{3}[source]
I have wondered - but have no evidence either way - if the stress we encounter nowadays differs to stress of the past. At some point very long ago most of us were stressing about things like food, water, surviving the night. Now most of us are stressing about things like work pressure, debt, global disasters. I wonder if the nature of the stressors have changed from immediate and acute to increasingly abstract and chronic? And potentially, if the quality of life profile is different in the two cases due to different coping mechanisms?

Very anecdotal which makes me think this: immediate physical stressors like exercise are uncomfortable but I get through them fine. Chronic stressors like climate change are totally ruining my quality of life.

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29. apples_oranges ◴[] No.44486732{4}[source]
I think you are right with chronic vs immediate stressors.

Economic anxiety could be the big one, and people don’t see the end of the tunnel.

replies(1): >>44488043 #
30. achierius ◴[] No.44486744[source]
It worked for the large majority. It now no longer works for that large majority, and practically also does not work well for the rest. We have in this sense regressed, thanks to the social liquidation of capitalism.
31. tudorconstantin ◴[] No.44486882{3}[source]
I have this personal theory that some time after an external stress-related impulse (be that negative - ww2, cold war, becoming paralyzed, etc, or positive - inheriting money, winning the lottery, not having to work for the rest of your life, finding the love of your lufe, etc), the brain adjusts and one comes back to the baseline of their perceived normal stress level. And that’s why we see people who are always happy and seemingly stress free despite having nothing, and ones that always seem stressed to the max despite having everything
32. intended ◴[] No.44487101{3}[source]
Heck no. We have “it’s always the quiet ones who go first”, to remind us what it was like from that time.

Most people suffered, and made the ones around them suffer as well. On top of that, you are in no position to move to an “average” position on the behavior spectrum, because it’s fundamentally outside your biological operational parameters.

There are TONS of relations which were kept in place, because of society, keeping people who made each other worse, in permanent proximity.

Survivorship bias is real.

We’re the ones who inherited the world with more knowledge than past generations, it’s up to us to do better with it. This will include getting better at diagnosing.

For self diagnosing, I have no idea what to do.

33. intended ◴[] No.44487116{5}[source]
What about diagnoses in countries which do not have any of these support systems?
replies(1): >>44493434 #
34. intended ◴[] No.44487143{3}[source]
Nothing changed - mostly it seems the American condition is a side effect of dedicated partisanship and asymmetric political behavior since the 1970s.

The media apparatus in America has split into a center and left, and then a right wing which has different norms and produces its own products.

That in turn has created a durable political coalition that self referentially calls itself when it needs to support its descriptions on reality.

It’s significantly more effective at producing narratives, and moving ideas from the fringes to the main stream news channels.

Since it has little traffic with the left and center media channels, it avoids counter claims and norms on journalistic standards.

So you can now primary Bipartisan politicians, and then the ideas that gain media attention are the ones that reinforces party talking points. Counter views simply do not get air time.

What we are seeing today, is the progression of those forces, as the narratives are never challenged.

35. theusus ◴[] No.44487241{3}[source]
We just suffered at that time and prayed. Today we suffer and work together.
replies(1): >>44487406 #
36. js8 ◴[] No.44487406{4}[source]
Also people used to smoke and drink a lot of alcohol. So it's possible that stress has objectively decreased, yet subjectively increased, as we are more aware of it.

But yeah it's an interesting question, and with the Internet as well. The 1980s world I grew up in as a kid (in Czechia) was more dangerous than the Internet-focused world of today; yet young people seem to be more stressed by the latter.

replies(1): >>44488057 #
37. shmageggy ◴[] No.44487768{4}[source]
I’m sure I’ve heard of research along these lines, and indeed searching for something like “modern stress versus…” finds some work, such as https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8832552/
38. KolibriFly ◴[] No.44487887[source]
Yeah, calling depression a "disorder" sometimes misses the point entirely when despair is a logical response to how things are
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39. nradov ◴[] No.44488010{3}[source]
Cheer up! For the average HN user, things are better now than they ever have been in human history.
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40. steve_taylor ◴[] No.44488018{3}[source]
DSM-5 took a bunch of distinct disorders and rolled them into one new disorder called Autism Spectrum Disorder. The only problem it solved is to reduce the number of disorders with unknown pathologies.

My classically-autistic son who needs a lot of support apparently has the same disorder as a nerdy guy who comes across as a bit abrasive, doesn't understand the point of small talk, and would rather work on Linux kernel patches on a Saturday night than hit the town.

41. nradov ◴[] No.44488043{5}[source]
Medieval peasants didn't see the end of the tunnel either. I'm skeptical that the type and quantity of stress is really worse now.
replies(2): >>44492188 #>>44495479 #
42. nradov ◴[] No.44488057{5}[source]
That depends on the time frame. Tobacco only spread beyond the Americas in the 16th century. And really poor people have never been able to afford much tobacco or alcohol; those are luxury products.
43. BlackFly ◴[] No.44488425{3}[source]
When you eliminate problems in people's lives, they do not suddenly feel that they have no problems. Instead they lower the bar for what they consider a problem. If the bar gets lowered too far, suddenly the previously minute things are problematic and there may be many of them.

Stress is caused by our internal perspective of our problems, not by some external unchanging measure of it.

44. bevesce- ◴[] No.44488694{4}[source]
Why is that a reason to cheer up? When I think about it, I’m miserable most of the time—and knowing that life was even worse for most people throughout history only makes me feel sadder.
replies(2): >>44488866 #>>44489185 #
45. scotty79 ◴[] No.44488866{5}[source]
I think he was being sarcastic. But on the internet you can't really tell.

Adopt absurdism. Nothing really matters and it's grotesquely hilarious at the same time. That might cheer you up. Occasionally.

replies(1): >>44489157 #
46. nradov ◴[] No.44489157{6}[source]
Not sarcastic. Only people who are ignorant about history believe that things are really bad today. If you live in an industrialized country that isn't in the middle of a shooting war then things are objectively pretty awesome compared to the average conditions that humans have endured.
replies(1): >>44489236 #
47. nradov ◴[] No.44489185{5}[source]
Turn that around and ask yourself why that's a reason to be miserable. Your sadness is a choice. Be miserable if you want to but that won't improve the circumstances for yourself or anyone else.
48. scotty79 ◴[] No.44489236{7}[source]
Only ignorant people think individuals can find comfort in averages.

Recently I heard Neil Degrasse Tyson saying that people came up with averages more recently than with calculus. It's not something people find relevant naturally.

replies(1): >>44490011 #
49. falcor84 ◴[] No.44489360{3}[source]
I know where you're coming from, but despair is never the logical response. Whatever the situation is, it's better to do something about it, even if it's just to rage and call for help, rather than to quietly despair.

Regardless of how bad things are, we still have hope, both as individuals and as a civilization.

replies(2): >>44490583 #>>44496082 #
50. thrance ◴[] No.44489483{3}[source]
Material conditions degrading further with no end in sight, a massive influx of money towards right-wing populists appealing to a frustrated middle class, etc. Same story as always. How can a country slide into authoritarianism? It seems impossible until it happens, and by then we can hardly tell we're there.
51. probably_wrong ◴[] No.44489684{4}[source]
If my finger is broken and someone says "Cheer up! Your neighbor lost his leg and is in an incredible amount of pain", I may feel sympathy for my neighbor but, crucially, my finger still hurts just as much.
replies(2): >>44490869 #>>44491058 #
52. wat10000 ◴[] No.44489799{4}[source]
Cheer up, the lake of shit you’re caged in is at its lowest level on record.

Slightly more seriously, things will be on an upward trajectory until they aren’t. There are some decent reasons to think we might be nearing the peak.

replies(1): >>44491920 #
53. wat10000 ◴[] No.44489831{3}[source]
Sounds like the lesson from Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer: deviation from the norm will be punished unless it’s exploitable.

Would your grandfather have been so well integrated if his problems had not been offset by such ability?

replies(1): >>44494104 #
54. gadabout ◴[] No.44490011{8}[source]
> Recently I heard Neil Degrasse Tyson saying that people came up with averages more recently than with calculus. It's not something people find relevant naturally.

Whoa now. That may be true within a strict scope of the "arithmetic mean" definition of "average", however, the idea of average as a 'concept' is much older. As an easy example, early references to agrarian yields (crop farming and how much food they produce) talk about average size of crop harvests, etc. Early tablets from Mesopotamia talk about average yield size, and those are dated 700ish BC.

55. DrillShopper ◴[] No.44490583{4}[source]
> despair is never the logical response

My partner is disabled and her transplanted kidney is failing. She will, in the next year or two, need dialysis and then a kidney transplant. Her Medicaid will be cut. The hospital she goes to will be closed. Both as a result of a bill that just passed. The average kidney transplant out of pocket costs $250,000, and because her first transplant happened before she met me, my insurance will deny her coverage because it's a pre-existing condition. We are in the process of trying to move to a different location, get her a job while she's going through kidney failure (not easy since nobody wants to hire a sick person, and definitely not at a workload that would give them benefits), and I'm in the process of trying to move us out of the country (I'm a dual citizen, she is not, so that's holding things up).

At what point in that is despair not a logical emotion, even when we're doing something about it? What is illogical about being so overwhelmed with circumstances that it makes you question whether waking up tomorrow is a net positive or negative? Please explain.

replies(1): >>44491128 #
56. nradov ◴[] No.44490869{5}[source]
Some of you guys need to cowboy up and quit whining about trivial problems. A broken finger is a minor injury (nothing even remotely like a lost leg), and usually easily managed with basic medical treatment. Get it splinted, pop an ibuprofen, and move on. It seems like a lot of HN users have led such soft, sheltered lives that they fall apart when faced with the slightest adversity.
57. jazzyjackson ◴[] No.44490980{4}[source]
chronically worrying about climate change is no different than chronically worrying about death. it's simple, stone age, existential fear.

ancient men and women coped with existential fear by either embracing that everything is a cycle, or inventing some semblance of immortality by raising children or believing in life after death.

I guess I have no stress about climate change because it seems very normal to me that society and biosystems occasionally collapse. The stress comes from thinking there's something that can be done to stop it, and feeling that you're unable to achieve it. Maybe that's me throwing my hands up and accepting death instead of trying to stave it off, I just want to throw out there that the stress is self imposed, not environmental.

58. DisruptiveDave ◴[] No.44491058{5}[source]
Right, it won't change the fact that the finger injury is sending pain signals to your brain. But it just might change what you do in reaction to that signal.
59. tblt ◴[] No.44491128{5}[source]
Despair seems eminently logical in your situation; I felt it, when I put myself in your shoes, reading your comment. That is not to say it need take precedence, or supremacy, to that most human of emotions: hope. I have hope, that you and your partner will prevail, and live a life agreeable to both your terms. I’m sure many who read your story will too. Please, lean on hope, not despair.
60. nradov ◴[] No.44491920{5}[source]
That's a meaningless claim, devoid of any evidence. At most points in human history there were decent reasons to think we were near the peak. And yet with some occasional temporary valleys, average human living conditions continued to improve.
replies(1): >>44492242 #
61. navane ◴[] No.44492163{3}[source]
Most of our suffering is in our imagination (Seneca) and our imaginative lives have never been as big as today. The world we think we live in has never been as big. The lives we think we could live have never been as many. The bad things that could happen to us are so much more plentyful and destructive than the bad things that do.
62. navane ◴[] No.44492188{6}[source]
At least they knew that this was temporal but heaven would be eternal. There was a point to things. When you stand for nothing you fall for everything. There's no story left in which we play.
63. wat10000 ◴[] No.44492242{6}[source]
At most points in human history, the global economy was not so tightly integrated, and major powers didn't have the ability to devastate the globe in an afternoon.

There is a significant meaning to my claim, which is that it's unconvincing to make exactly the sort of "it has always worked out before" argument that you're making here.

replies(1): >>44493428 #
64. navane ◴[] No.44492292[source]
I'm pretty sure current highly interconnected society elicts more spectrum behavior then back when 90% of the populace was just digging soil for grains.
65. acheron ◴[] No.44493428{7}[source]
The current time is not special just because it's when you're alive.
replies(1): >>44493613 #
66. stevenAthompson ◴[] No.44493434{6}[source]
This is a really great question. I checked.

Turns out that the poorer a nation is, the less reported autism they have. That could be because there is no benefit to the diagnosis or it could be because they have less healthcare in general and a real diagnosis can easily take 4-8 hours of clinical time.

Interesting either way.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9386174/

replies(1): >>44495235 #
67. wat10000 ◴[] No.44493613{8}[source]
Conversely, the current time isn't like the past just because it immediately follows the past.
68. stevenAthompson ◴[] No.44494050{5}[source]
66% of autistic adults admit having suicidal thoughts. 35% have attempted suicide.

If they're faking it for benefits they are REALLY committed to the bit.

69. const_cast ◴[] No.44494104{4}[source]
You're downvoted but you're correct. Disordered people who did not offer some sort of economic gain in a market were simply institutionalized. Autistic people who were not high functioning were pretty much as good as dead. Same thing goes for depression, anxiety, and schizophrenia. We had no systems in place for people who cannot work. Physical disabilities were more of the same. If you could work, it was okay-ish. You'll still get treated as a freak and discriminated against daily, but you weren't completely shut out of society. If you couldn't work, however...
70. nradov ◴[] No.44495235{7}[source]
Or it could be because poorer countries actually have lower rates of autism. I'm not claiming that's the case, just that we don't have any reliable data on it one way or the other.
71. mcdeltat ◴[] No.44495479{6}[source]
Medieval peasantry times may already be well into the "abstract chronic stress" period. Humans have been around a while.
72. anal_reactor ◴[] No.44496082{4}[source]
> Regardless of how bad things are, we still have hope, both as individuals and as a civilization.

No we don't. Evidence: falling birthrates is the society collectively deciding that live ain't worth it. Personally, I think this is the real reason why we don't see aliens - any advanced civilisation will eventually reach a point where it realizes that life ain't worth it.

73. spicyusername ◴[] No.44499853[source]
One thing that makes me nervous about a culture that is so quick to forward people to therapists, is that therapy is not some ironclad medical practice, like you might imagine heart surgery to be.

Therapy, and psychology in general, is one of the weakest areas of science, still based mostly on mysticism, large personalities, and weak statistical correlations. And that is assuming you even can get a "good" therapist, and not some schmuck who just happened to nab the degree.

I would go so far as to say that 90%+ of problems that are served in therapy sessions are better served by the regular participants in an intimate social network, friends and family, than some "expert" who is incentivized, knowingly or not, to send you into the pharmaceutical pipeline or, as this article describes, hand you a bunch of random labels you can forever use to psychologically handicap yourself with.

74. ryuker16 ◴[] No.44518150[source]
Your leaving out that people with mental and even physical issues often were outcasts for revealing them to their family, friends, and community in the past.

Some of that supoort wasnt present.