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Are we the baddies?

(geohot.github.io)
692 points AndrewSwift | 5 comments | | HN request time: 0.435s | source
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afiodorov ◴[] No.44478380[source]
We should not underestimate the timeless human response to being manipulated: disengagement.

This isn't theoretical, it's happening right now. The boom in digital detoxes, the dumbphone revival among young people, the shift from public feeds to private DMs, and the "Do Not Disturb" generation are all symptoms of the same thing. People are feeling the manipulation and are choosing to opt out, one notification at a time.

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alganet ◴[] No.44478542[source]
> disengagement.

That disengagement metric is valuable, I'm not gonna give it away for free anymore. I'll engage and disengage randomly, so no one knows what works.

> The boom in digital detoxes, the dumbphone revival among young people

That's a market now. It doesn't mean shit. It's a "lifestyle".

> People are feeling the manipulation

They don't. Even manipulation awareness is a market now. I'm sure there are YouTubers who thrive on it.

---

How far can you game a profiling algorithm? Can you make it think something about you that you're not? How much can one break it?

Those are the interesting questions.

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afiodorov ◴[] No.44478622[source]
There's nothing an algorithm can do against disciplined, intentional engagement.

If you know which car you want to buy it doesn't matter what the salesman has to say.

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1. latexr ◴[] No.44479376[source]
> If you know which car you want to buy it doesn't matter what the salesman has to say.

Sure it does. The salesman may have information you were not aware of. They could even tell you something which satisfies your needs better and is cheaper. Not all salesman are out to screw you, some really care about a happy customer.

I’m reminded of an old Hypercritical episode. If you ever heard John Siracusa, you know he does his research and knows what he wants. Yet when it came time buy a TV, which he had intensively researched, the salesman mentioned plasma and how the tech had improved and it threw a wrench in Siracusa’s whole decision.

https://overcast.fm/+AA3EXrnIDrA/1:23:08

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2. denkmoon ◴[] No.44480477[source]
How intensively can you possibly have researched if a salesman mentioning an entire category of display technology is a curve ball for you.
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3. const_cast ◴[] No.44483313[source]
The heuristic is that pretty much anyone who is trying to sell you something is out to screw you. They are probably lying, and they are probably trying to get a quick buck from people who don't know better. And when I say anyone, I mean anyone. Youtubers, anyone on TikTok who links anything, advertisements on the web, billboards.

It's not 100% but if you follow the heuristic you save a lot of money and generally have higher quality goods in your life.

The reason we got into this mess is because advertising on the internet broke all the rules. Now lying is de-facto allowed. So then everyone else followed suit to compete. If your competitors are lying, you cannot afford not to lie.

So now all advertisement and sales are compromised and should not be trusted. Even large, previously trusted corporations are running scams in America. Professionals making six figures are acting as con artists. It's unbelievable how fast the situation has deteriorated.

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4. latexr ◴[] No.44483559[source]
> How intensively can you possibly have researched

Listen to it. Start way before the given timestamp.

5. ryandrake ◴[] No.44483797[source]
Exactly. People say "Oh, I'm not affected by advertising, and I ignore sales pitches. I am very smart and do my own research!" But what are they researching? Marketing literature! They think they are informing themselves, but in reality, they are just seeking out marketing disguised as impartial facts.

I laugh when people say "I use site:reddit.com to scope my Google searches for product information because I'm getting impartial information from real people."