←back to thread

627 points cratermoon | 5 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
Show context
gyomu ◴[] No.44461457[source]
Broadly agreed with all the points outlined in there.

But for me the biggest issue with all this — that I don't see covered in here, or maybe just a little bit in passing — is what all of this is doing to beginners, and the learning pipeline.

> There are people I once respected who, apparently, don’t actually enjoy doing the thing. They would like to describe what they want and receive Whatever — some beige sludge that vaguely resembles it. That isn’t programming, though.

> I glimpsed someone on Twitter a few days ago, also scoffing at the idea that anyone would decide not to use the Whatever machine. I can’t remember exactly what they said, but it was something like: “I created a whole album, complete with album art, in 3.5 hours. Why wouldn’t I use the make it easier machine?”

When you're a beginner, it's totally normal to not really want to put in the hard work. You try drawing a picture, and it sucks. You try playing the guitar, and you can't even get simple notes right. Of course a machine where you can just say "a picture in the style of Pokémon, but of my cat" and get a perfect result out is much more tempting to a 12 year old kid than the prospect of having to grind for 5 years before being kind of good.

But up until now, you had no choice and to keep making crappy pictures and playing crappy songs until you actually start to develop a taste for the effort, and a few years later you find yourself actually pretty darn competent at the thing. That's a pretty virtuous cycle.

I shudder to think where we'll be if the corporate-media machine keeps hammering the message "you don't have to bother learning how to draw, drawing is hard, just get ChatGPT to draw pictures for you" to young people for years to come.

replies(16): >>44461502 #>>44461693 #>>44461707 #>>44461712 #>>44461825 #>>44461881 #>>44461890 #>>44462182 #>>44462219 #>>44462354 #>>44462799 #>>44463172 #>>44463206 #>>44463495 #>>44463650 #>>44464426 #
raincole ◴[] No.44461707[source]
People will write lengthy and convoluted explanation on why LLM isn't like calculator or microwave oven or other technology before. (Like OP's article) But it really is. Humans have been looking for easier and lazier ways to do things since the dawn of civilization.

Tech never ever prevents people who really want to hone their skills from doing so. World record of 100m sprint kept improving even since car was invented. World record of how many digits of pi memorized kept improving even when a computer does that indefinitely times better.

It's ridiculous to think drawing will become a lost art because of LLM/Diffusal models when we live in a reality where powerlifting is a thing.

replies(20): >>44461789 #>>44461829 #>>44461944 #>>44461983 #>>44462378 #>>44462425 #>>44462566 #>>44462584 #>>44463027 #>>44463112 #>>44463267 #>>44463461 #>>44463609 #>>44463974 #>>44464030 #>>44465371 #>>44465680 #>>44466064 #>>44467092 #>>44498406 #
bryanrasmussen ◴[] No.44461829[source]
>LLM isn't like calculator or microwave oven or other technology before. (Like OP's article) But it really is.

I would not buy a calculator that hallucinated wrong answers part of the time. Or a microwave oven that told you it grilled the chicken but it didn't and you have to die from Salmonella poisoning.

replies(8): >>44461952 #>>44461962 #>>44461979 #>>44462020 #>>44462033 #>>44462101 #>>44464095 #>>44464488 #
JW_00000 ◴[] No.44461962[source]
My grandma did not have a microwave oven because she didn't see the point of it.
replies(3): >>44462103 #>>44463160 #>>44463588 #
Al-Khwarizmi ◴[] No.44462103[source]
I'm in my 40s and don't have a microwave oven because I don't see the point of it... when I lived in a rented apartment, I got gifted one because how could I not have one? I tried it for a few days and just didn't find it useful. When I bought my own apartment and renovated the kitchen, I didn't bother to install one.
replies(2): >>44462319 #>>44468511 #
Semaphor ◴[] No.44462319[source]
The use is heating up single portions of leftovers.
replies(2): >>44462346 #>>44466911 #
Al-Khwarizmi ◴[] No.44462346[source]
Which can be done in an induction cooker almost as fast, with the result tasting better, and without the need of a specific appliance that takes up considerable space.
replies(1): >>44462428 #
1. Semaphor ◴[] No.44462428[source]
I guess, if you have one of those. Vastly more expensive and more involved to install, especially when renting. I’ve never used one because I’ve never been at a place with one.
replies(1): >>44462706 #
2. Al-Khwarizmi ◴[] No.44462706[source]
When I rented I had a standard ceramic hob and still didn't see the point... sure, you gain some time, but it's maybe 5 minutes of unattended time where you can often be doing something else, vs. much worse taste. But I understand that with slow cookers it can make sense for other people. With induction I think it's outright pointless.

As an anecdote, in my country there is a very popular brand of supermarket pizzas, Casa Tarradellas. I never buy them but a friend of mine used to eat them really frequently. So once he shows up at my house with one, and I say OK, I'm going to heat it. I serve it, he tries a bite and is totally blown away. He says "What did you do? I've been eating these pizzas for years and they never taste like this, this is amazing, the best Casa Tarradellas pizza I've ever had".

The answer was that he used the microwave and I had heated it in the regular oven...

replies(1): >>44462951 #
3. Semaphor ◴[] No.44462951[source]
> vs. much worse taste

I have never had that issue when heating stuff up. Your pizza example is not reheating (and generally you never want to reheat anything that’s supposed to be crispy in the microwave; though not on the stove top either).

replies(1): >>44463483 #
4. ted_bunny ◴[] No.44463483{3}[source]
Reheat pizza on a stovetop covered on low heat. Better than the first time it was cooked. Yw
replies(1): >>44463528 #
5. Semaphor ◴[] No.44463528{4}[source]
I prefer convection ovens for that.