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131 points Traces | 18 comments | | HN request time: 1.587s | source | bottom
1. v5v3 ◴[] No.44442262[source]
If Spain can get support from across the EU. And Brazil the same from BRICS then we could see change.

Best not to hold your breath though...

replies(2): >>44442309 #>>44442363 #
2. raverbashing ◴[] No.44442309[source]
BRICS is just an acronym, it is void of any meaningful significance other than that.

Edit: "oh but it's an actual organization" yeah with still very little significance between pretending it's anything but a convenient proxy for the bigger members

replies(3): >>44442326 #>>44442357 #>>44442369 #
3. diggan ◴[] No.44442326[source]
> BRICS is just an acronym, it is void of any meaningful significance other than that.

I think your understanding of BRICS might be slightly outdated, did you read about the last time in the late 90s or something? It's beyond just an acronym today, with institutions actively involved, new initiatives and more.

4. impossiblefork ◴[] No.44442357[source]
I don't think, just an acronym, but my impression is that the only thing BRICS or BRICS+ agree on and are actively co-operating to achieve is collectively getting off the dollar and ending the effects of the so-called exorbitant privilege on themselves.
replies(1): >>44442523 #
5. graemep ◴[] No.44442363[source]
A lot of EU countries have enormous tax breaks for the rich.

There is a consensus that non-dom status (basically rich foreigners, very broadly defined, pay hardly any tax) in the UK needs to go. The main point made by people opposing this is that they can easily move to a number European (mostly EU) countries that have similar schemes and still only be a short flight away from the UK.

replies(1): >>44442668 #
6. gchamonlive ◴[] No.44442369[source]
It's an actual organization actually, founded in 2009. They hold meetings globally, the next one set to be held here in Brazil in 4 days. Since it's an organizational to align economic goals among other topics, it's not unthinkable to have these kinds of discussions about progressive taxing. We can question the real effectiveness of BRICS for actually taxing the rich more extensively, but it is surely much more than an acronym.
replies(2): >>44442431 #>>44442452 #
7. raverbashing ◴[] No.44442431{3}[source]
Yes. An organization that lacks any meaningful action besides bureaucratic merry-go-around

It's a puppet show essentially

replies(1): >>44442488 #
8. v5v3 ◴[] No.44442452{3}[source]
Yes. It is the 2nd most powerful alliance after the USA/Canada/Australia/Europe one.

India seem a flaky member of the Brics, but rest seem very committed.

9. gchamonlive ◴[] No.44442488{4}[source]
Completely orthogonal to it being an organisation and not an acronym
replies(1): >>44442749 #
10. owebmaster ◴[] No.44442523{3}[source]
If that is the "only" thing, it is quite the ambitious goal
replies(1): >>44445993 #
11. bluecalm ◴[] No.44442668[source]
I don't understand why politicians call for taxing assets but fail to tax assets they control in their own country. Why are super rich non-doms a problem in UK? Oh, they own a lot of land and real estate? You can tax it right there.

Or maybe I do understand - it has nothing to do with trying to fix the problem but is just a populist agenda that sounds good and helps with winning elections.

replies(2): >>44442731 #>>44443083 #
12. v5v3 ◴[] No.44442731{3}[source]
People in the UK and other countries are heavily taxed at source. And they see it on their monthly wage slip.

And many people don't do a job they love, they do it as they need the money, and are miserable.

The 'look at at that group who are not paying their share and the party in charge is responsible , but we will change it if you vote for us' is one of the easiest plays to get votes and volunteers campaigning for you.

13. ◴[] No.44442749{5}[source]
14. graemep ◴[] No.44443083{3}[source]
Why should people living an a country not pay tax in that country? its a general principle that you pay tax on your income to the government of the country you live in.

If you regard progressive taxation as "populist", fine. I regard it as simple being fair.

To put it another way, why should there be a special exemption so super-rich foreigners do not have to pay tax?

> To put it another way, why should there be a special exemption so super-rich foreigners do not have to pay tax?

I do not know what you are referring to here. The non-dom issue is primarily about taxing income.

replies(1): >>44443155 #
15. bluecalm ◴[] No.44443155{4}[source]
>>Why should people living an a country not pay tax in that country? its a general principle that you pay tax on your income to the government of the country you live in.

Terrible principle. You should pay proportionally to what you use/spend in the country. These days it's very difficult to say who lives where, especially in case of rich people. If someone spends 200 days in one country and 160 in another it's unfair to the latter country that 100% of the tax is paid in the first one. If someone spend their time across 3 countries current solutions don't make any sense at all. That's why it makes sense to tax assets locally.

The concept of "tax residency" belonging to one country is just a terrible idea. It's the reason a lot of those abusive schemes exists. The way is to get rid of that principle and substitute it with something that is not easy to get around like taxing assets under your control.

>>To put it another way, why should there be a special exemption so super-rich foreigners do not have to pay tax?

There shouldn't be. They should pay on assets they use in your country. If they have income there you can tax income issuer (like payroll tax). There is no need to tax income from abroad - let other countries who actually control assets that produce that income tax them.

replies(1): >>44445133 #
16. graemep ◴[] No.44445133{5}[source]
you are still arguing for a special exemption for the rich - or do you think that anyone who invests abroad should be exempt on tax on income from those assets? It would also create more loopholes. It would also create an inceniltive to invest abroad.

A shift from taxing income to taxing assets instead might work. A wealth tax instead but its not easy. Land can be valued, so can publicly traded investments. What about ownership of privately held businesses or works of art? Where are yachts and aircraft taxed?

replies(1): >>44447437 #
17. impossiblefork ◴[] No.44445993{4}[source]
Maybe, but should it really be hard?

Either one gets rid of the oil trade-- which I think is quite feasible, then the need to acquire dollars to buy these products goes away, so there's nothing more needed, or one negotiates something with one of the many countries which either have or could acquire the ability to produce oil where one bypasses the dollar trade.

Maybe, if they didn't have Russia in the group and had talked to more people about the sanctions, something like 'we need this, and the alternative is Russia-- can't you be flexible and not sanction Venezuela', they could have even used Venezuela.

18. bluecalm ◴[] No.44447437{6}[source]
There shouldn't be tax on income. There should be tax on assets. Don't tax income from land, tax land value.

This also avoids a loophole that buying land and doing nothing on it means you pay very little taxes while patiently waiting for its value to increase because of other people who do productive things nearby

>>or do you think that anyone who invests abroad should be exempt on tax on income from those assets

Of course, those should be taxed where they are located. Much easier to tax companies where they operate than elusive "income" of increasing stock value.

>>What about ownership of privately held businesse

You don't need to tax wealth related to business. Your can make operating businesses more expensive by introducing taxes and fees on it and then not tax any income it still generates.

EU politicians intuitively know that's the way when talking about digital tax. Just tax "IP protection" as % of revenue in your country for example. Then you will get a share of Apple or Google no matter where it's registered as long as it has revenue in your country.

It's way easier to make Google generate 20% less profit than to tax 20% on its profits. It's also very easy to tax it where it's operates and not care about creative accounting tricks it uses to show less profit.

The current system means people living on Cyprus pay less tax on Google value than Americans. It's just a completely stupid system that breeds abuse.