←back to thread

85 points signa11 | 7 comments | | HN request time: 0.543s | source | bottom
1. EduardLev ◴[] No.44371192[source]
This focuses on what managers should do differently, but not what engineers could do differently to make the relationship better. Improve their communication skills, document and evangelize their work, etc.
replies(5): >>44371923 #>>44372847 #>>44373995 #>>44374029 #>>44385307 #
2. Velorivox ◴[] No.44371923[source]
When I have a poor manager who doesn’t improve quickly, what I do differently is get a different job. I understand that’s a privileged position to be in, and also that one needs to have a fair bit of experience to identify whether the manager really is the issue. Nevertheless, trying to fix a relationship one-sidedly when someone holds authority over you is not a worthwhile cause.
3. dragonsky67 ◴[] No.44372847[source]
This does depend on what the engineers are being employed to do..

Are they there to be communication and documentation experts, or are they there to turn requirements into something that works?

I agree that there is benefits in having engineers who can engage with their managers, advocate for required changes and influence the management to act in a more beneficial way, but at some point the person doing this stops being an engineer and starts being a manager themself.

Managers are there to manage, that is organise, coordinate and ensure that their staff are completing tasks in the most efficient way possible. That will at time require them to communicate with both their superiors and their engineer staff. That requires them to be the the communication and documentation expert, not the engineer.

replies(1): >>44372887 #
4. ◴[] No.44372887[source]
5. sublinear ◴[] No.44373995[source]
I love how many times I've heard "communication skills" wheeled out as an excuse for management's lack of deep focus on their team's work.
6. danielscrubs ◴[] No.44374029[source]
If you put 50% effort on marketing yourself and 50% on engineering, the company will quickly be put out of business.

Worse, those that are good at talking are going to waste everyone else’s time.

I said half because that seems to align with the marketing budget vs engineering budget, so it might be the best spot for companies as a whole.

7. watwut ◴[] No.44385307[source]
> Improve their communication skills, document and evangelize their work, etc.

Whether engineers do or don't do documentation and how much of it is decided by management.

Second, unless you are specific, I will assume the "improve their communication skills" is purely stereotype based. They are engineers, therefore they do not have communication skills. And we are going to pretend so even though they just communicated what they need very very clearly and politely.