←back to thread

1479 points sandslash | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0.233s | source
Show context
abdullin ◴[] No.44316210[source]
Tight feedback loops are the key in working productively with software. I see that in codebases up to 700k lines of code (legacy 30yo 4GL ERP systems).

The best part is that AI-driven systems are fine with running even more tight loops than what a sane human would tolerate.

Eg. running full linting, testing and E2E/simulation suite after any minor change. Or generating 4 versions of PR for the same task so that the human could just pick the best one.

replies(7): >>44316306 #>>44316946 #>>44317531 #>>44317792 #>>44318080 #>>44318246 #>>44318794 #
latexr ◴[] No.44317792[source]
> Or generating 4 versions of PR for the same task so that the human could just pick the best one.

That sounds awful. A truly terrible and demotivating way to work and produce anything of real quality. Why are we doing this to ourselves and embracing it?

A few years ago, it would have been seen as a joke to say “the future of software development will be to have a million monkey interns banging on one million keyboards and submit a million PRs, then choose one”. Today, it’s lauded as a brilliant business and cost-saving idea.

We’re beyond doomed. The first major catastrophe caused by sloppy AI code can’t come soon enough. The sooner it happens, the better chance we have to self-correct.

replies(6): >>44317876 #>>44317884 #>>44317997 #>>44318175 #>>44318235 #>>44318625 #
diggan ◴[] No.44317884[source]
> A truly terrible and demotivating way to work and produce anything of real quality

You clearly have strong feelings about it, which is fine, but it would be much more interesting to know exactly why it would terrible and demotivating, and why it cannot produce anything of quality? And what is "real quality" and does that mean "fake quality" exists?

> million monkey interns banging on one million keyboards and submit a million PRs

I'm not sure if you misunderstand LLMs, or the famous "monkeys writing Shakespeare" part, but that example is more about randomness and infinity than about probabilistic machines somewhat working towards a goal with some non-determinism.

> We’re beyond doomed

The good news is that we've been doomed for a long time, yet we persist. If you take a look at how the internet is basically held up by duct-tape at this point, I think you'd feel slightly more comfortable with how crap absolutely everything is. Like 1% of software is actually Good Software while the rest barely works on a good day.

replies(2): >>44317983 #>>44318020 #
3dsnano ◴[] No.44317983[source]
> And what is "real quality" and does that mean "fake quality" exists?

I think there is no real quality or fake quality, just quality. I am referencing the quality that Persig and C. Alexander have written about.

It’s… qualitative, so it’s hard to measure but easy to feel. Humans are really good at perceiving it then making objective decisions. LLMs don’t know what it is (they’ve heard about it and think they know).

replies(2): >>44318438 #>>44319060 #
1. abdullin ◴[] No.44318438[source]
It is actually funny that current AI+Coding tools benefit a lot from domain context and other information along the lines of Domain-Driven Design (which was inspired by the pattern language of C. Alexander).

A few teams have started incorporating `CONTEXT.MD` into module descriptions to leverage this.