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713 points greenburger | 1 comments | | HN request time: 1.536s | source
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elric ◴[] No.44297158[source]
Can we get a federated messenger already?

Sure, we have email, but the MS/Google duopoloy has effectively unfederated that, with their inscrutable block lists and nonexistent appeals processes, allegedly in order to protect you from spam.

Sure, XMPP is a thing, which has been mostly dead for well over a decade.

Sure, Matrix is a thing, but every time I look at it, all I see is criticism of its specifications and poor interoperability between implementations?

What would it take to sort out this mess? More money for Matrix or XMPP? Someone with enough clout to promote them? I'm sure organizations like the UN or the EU would, in theory, be in favour of an effective global communicator. But those same organizations would like rail against encryption and decentralisation.

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upofadown ◴[] No.44297638[source]
I think the most valid criticism of Matrix for interoperability is that it was promoted as an interoperability standard but it was made incompatible with everything existing at the time. XMPP was based on XML for example, but Matrix is based on json. So by introducing yet another standard, Matrix creates yet another standards fork and dilutes everything that came before.

We have to get to the point where progress in messaging is incremental, not revolutionary.

How do you tell that an open standard is "dead"? There are zillions of XMPP servers around with lots of people quietly using them. For a standard to be "alive" does there have to be a large revenue stream associated with it? Does it need a large commercial entity promoting it?

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1. NoGravitas ◴[] No.44298988[source]
I think the real problem with Matrix and interoperability is that there is functionally only one server implementation, controlled by one organization. There are more client implementations, but generally if they want to support encryption, they have to depend on one library implementation.