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689 points taubek | 2 comments | | HN request time: 0.546s | source
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rayiner ◴[] No.43632822[source]
Americans need to get over their view of “Asia” as being about making shoes. When I was working in engineering in the early aughts, we mocked the Chinese as being able only to copy American technology. Today, China is competitive with or ahead of America in key technology areas, including nuclear power, AI, EVs, and batteries.

We need to anticipate a future where China is equal to America on a per capita basis, but four times bigger. Is that a world where “Designed by Apple in California, Made in China” still makes sense? What will be America’s competitive edge in that scenario?

What seems most likely to me in the future is that the US will find itself in the same position the UK is in now. Dominating finance and services won’t mean anything when both the IP and the physical products are being produced somewhere else.

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pjc50 ◴[] No.43633979[source]
> US will find itself in the same position the UK is in now

The thing is .. there's a point here, but it's not at all tied in with physical products. People are obsessed with one side of the ledger while refusing to see the other. Most of the stuff the UK is struggling with (transport, healthcare, energy) are "state capacity" issues. Things where the state is unavoidably involved and having better, more decisive leadership and not getting bogged down in consultations, would make a big difference.

The UK stepped on its own rake because it was obsessed with tiny, already vanished industries like fishing. Fishing is less profitable for the whole UK than Warhammer. It's not actually where we want to be. While real UK manufacture successes (cars, aircraft, satellites, generators, all sorts of high-tech stuff) get completely ignored. Or bogged down in extra export red tape thanks to Brexit.

To improve reality, we have to start from reality, not whatever vision of the past propaganda "news" channels are blathering about.

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rayiner ◴[] No.43635699[source]
The free traders also need to accept the reality that the UK’s decline started long before Brexit and disputes about fishing. In terms of per capita GDP, the UK lost its edge over the rest of Europe in the 1970s, and then simply never recovered from the 2008 global financial collapse. Without the empire, the UK’s “competitive advantage” in financial and legal services wasn’t worth shit.

I strongly suspect the US cannot maintain its outsized per capita wealth, on the back of the reserve dollar, in a world where China has an economy twice the size. Just as the UK couldn’t when the US economy overtook the British empire and the dollar replaced the pound as the reserve currency.

The question, instead, is how we’ll be able to adapt to that new reality. And I suspect we’d rather be Germany in that future than the UK.

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sdwr ◴[] No.43636769[source]
Yeah this is arguably the tail wagging the dog - Trump is a reaction to the end of US hegemony, not the cause
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watwut ◴[] No.43637956[source]
Trump has zero to do with previous level of US hegemony. He represents what large part of Americans are - for internal reasons that have nothing to do with geopolitics.
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hkt ◴[] No.43638316[source]
Americans might not know their number is up explicitly, but they can smell it. The days of US hegemony are numbered. In one way or another, people get it. Why else would they want to Make America Great Again? It is an inherent recognition of decline.
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refurb ◴[] No.43642114[source]
I’d say it’s the opposite.

So much of the US government has been focused on maintaining the global hegemony, US citizens wellbeing was sacrificed.

Trump was elected in reaction to rising global hegemony, or at least the effort put to maintain it, not the end of it.

To say US hegemony is numbered doesn’t make much sense. The US economy has only pulled headed further from any Western rival, and China’s economy is stumbling to the point it’s questionable if it can grow enough before it’s population starts shrinking. Russia has been stagnant since the 1990’s.

If anything, US ability to project power is greater now than any time in the past.

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1. watwut ◴[] No.43642479[source]
> If anything, US ability to project power is greater now than any time in the past.

Absolutely not. It caved to Russia in the first place, it is weak against Russia. It WANTS to project power, but while doing so, it is showing itself crumbling into itself.

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2. K0balt ◴[] No.43642667[source]
The US unwillingness to project power is a direct result of its current leadership. The US capability to project military force is, for better or for worse, pretty extreme in the global context. The ability to support a protracted conflict would depend on the support of the population, but it’s unwise to think that the current administration is a reflection of potential. When the court jester carries the sword, it’s a blunt and careless rod, but that same sword in the hands of a master is an instrument of lethal precision.

The sword remains unchanged.