←back to thread

666 points jcartw | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
Show context
SwiftyBug ◴[] No.43620583[source]
I've been living in Brazil for the last 20 years.

Pix revolutionised the way we transact in Brazil. I've used Pix to pay for things that cost only cents, and I have a friend who bought her house using Pix. The system just works for any transfer amount. And it's so easy to use.

Its speed is truly baffling, and so is its reliability. Never have I failed to make a Pix payment because of downtime. I never cease to be amazed by how fast money arrives in my Brazilian account when I make a withdrawal directly from my EUR wallet on Wise. I receive a push notification from my Brazilian bank before Wise finishes running the animation of confirmation of withdrawal. It's like magic.

And it's so widespread that nowadays I don't even question whether someone accepts Pix. When I get in a taxi, no matter how old the driver is, it's certain that they take (and prefer) Pix.

I've even had homeless people ask me for Pix instead of change on multiple occasions.

Cryptocurrencies don't stand a chance.

replies(32): >>43620618 #>>43620630 #>>43620653 #>>43620658 #>>43620741 #>>43620818 #>>43620824 #>>43620883 #>>43620954 #>>43621164 #>>43621188 #>>43621341 #>>43621460 #>>43621833 #>>43621851 #>>43622093 #>>43622233 #>>43622479 #>>43622501 #>>43622627 #>>43622888 #>>43623111 #>>43623692 #>>43624345 #>>43624424 #>>43624538 #>>43626843 #>>43627268 #>>43627624 #>>43628278 #>>43629343 #>>43630864 #
WinstonSmith84 ◴[] No.43624538[source]
> Cryptocurrencies don't stand a chance.

Now, try to use Pix outside of Brazil - it's not even used in other Mercosur countries, what's the chance of having that adopted in other countries... And, that's problem #1.

How much do you trust your government with your money? A system like Pix don't stand a chance to get a worldwide adoption - maybe people are naive but governments won't unify to adopt a common system controlled by just a single entity / country.

What we may however end up with, are dozens of systems like Pix, one for each country, union, etc. Still cryptocurrencies as-is remain relevant (see point 1)

replies(25): >>43625367 #>>43625375 #>>43625647 #>>43626773 #>>43626927 #>>43627273 #>>43627295 #>>43627393 #>>43627721 #>>43628266 #>>43628397 #>>43628617 #>>43628632 #>>43629104 #>>43629151 #>>43629239 #>>43629613 #>>43629873 #>>43630034 #>>43630698 #>>43631142 #>>43631269 #>>43631814 #>>43632631 #>>43635833 #
reaperducer ◴[] No.43625367[source]
try to use Pix outside of Brazil

Try to use cryptocurrency for anything other than a few very specific transactions at a number of places in the world so small that it's a rounding error.

Still cryptocurrencies as-is remain relevant

And somehow less relevant than cash.

I can take cash from any country in the world to my local bank, and deposit it into my account. I can get a dozen different foreign currencies at my local branch in minutes, and almost any other currency in the world can be delivered to me by FedEx the next morning for a flat $10 fee.

I can take cash to any other country in the world and get it converted into the local currency, whether that's paper or digital in almost any city.

Crypto is great if you do a very few, very specific things in a vanishingly small number of places. But if I'd tied my finances to crypto instead of cash, I'd have been stuck many times in foreign lands.

replies(1): >>43626233 #
WinstonSmith84 ◴[] No.43626233[source]
> I can take cash from any country in the world to my local bank, and deposit it into my account.

If you are at a institution bank, probably but that's a non-existent use case - I never had Argentinian Pesos, Turkish Lira or Bulgarian Lev I suddenly needed to deposit into my bank account !..

> Try to use cryptocurrency for anything other than a few very specific transactions at a number of places in the world so small that it's a rounding error.

I'm not sure whether you travel much, but I always travel as a digital nomad. I pay small transactions with local cash or mostly bank cards as everybody does. But big amounts? That's where crypto comes into play. I've paid in crypto transactions worth a few thousands dollars because that's the only way to do it without incurring huge transaction fees and / or long processing time.

replies(5): >>43626821 #>>43627485 #>>43627648 #>>43629928 #>>43633711 #
Spivak ◴[] No.43627648[source]
> that's the only way to do it without incurring huge transaction fees and / or long processing time.

You're joking right? I just did a $25,000 wire internationally with a currency exchange in the middle and it cost $75. It went through in one business day. You'll get more hassle trying to withdraw from your exchange than that.

When I bought my house and did the wire it cost $15. Where are you getting huge transaction fees?

replies(4): >>43627784 #>>43628557 #>>43629086 #>>43629914 #
kspacewalk2 ◴[] No.43628557[source]
The flat fee is a small part of what that transfer costs. The real transaction fee is embedded in the exchange rate. 2% markup is not an unheard of amount, which I guess would make your total cost $515 and not $15.

There's a reason Wise is a huge business and people in Canada resort to "Norbert's gambit" to exchange currency with minimal transaction costs.

replies(1): >>43628856 #
Spivak ◴[] No.43628856{3}[source]
I think it was about 1% off the "theoretical best" exchange rate I could have gotten. But I don't exactly have access to those kinds of rates as an individual. Do crypto trades not have the same dynamic once you involve exchanges? Once you include the take from the USD ~> Crypto ~> $Other do you still come out ahead?
replies(1): >>43634936 #
1. kspacewalk2 ◴[] No.43634936{4}[source]
No idea, never owned or used crypto. I guess for large amounts the reference point should be total transaction cost using Wise and/or some version of Norbert's gambit if your currency pair is a popular one and dual-listed securities/ETFs are readily available.