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Brazil's government-run payments system has become dominant

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666 points jcartw | 10 comments | 08 Apr 25 10:59 UTC | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom
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SwiftyBug ◴[08 Apr 25 11:48 UTC] No.43620583[source]▶
I've been living in Brazil for the last 20 years.

Pix revolutionised the way we transact in Brazil. I've used Pix to pay for things that cost only cents, and I have a friend who bought her house using Pix. The system just works for any transfer amount. And it's so easy to use.

Its speed is truly baffling, and so is its reliability. Never have I failed to make a Pix payment because of downtime. I never cease to be amazed by how fast money arrives in my Brazilian account when I make a withdrawal directly from my EUR wallet on Wise. I receive a push notification from my Brazilian bank before Wise finishes running the animation of confirmation of withdrawal. It's like magic.

And it's so widespread that nowadays I don't even question whether someone accepts Pix. When I get in a taxi, no matter how old the driver is, it's certain that they take (and prefer) Pix.

I've even had homeless people ask me for Pix instead of change on multiple occasions.

Cryptocurrencies don't stand a chance.

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Xunjin ◴[08 Apr 25 14:31 UTC] No.43622233[source]▶
The world needs to implement Pix. I truly believe that is a system which can replace SWIFT with just a intermediary, with a virtual currency that exchange rate between the 2 countries in the operation, this way the world can have a freedom outside dollar and really fast transactions.
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leereeves ◴[08 Apr 25 15:02 UTC] No.43622600[source]▶
I'd hate to see a system like that where I live, because the government will abuse it. We've already seen Canada freeze bank accounts of protestors, and US officials put protestors on the no fly list.
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mixmastamyk ◴[08 Apr 25 16:36 UTC] No.43623679[source]▶
The govt already has full access to your bank account! Always did and KYC ended privacy.

Preventing convenient payment technology only hurts the rest of us. If you want redundancy buy gold coins.

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1. welshwelsh ◴[08 Apr 25 16:48 UTC] No.43623806[source]▶
We should focus on getting rid of KYC, instead of giving up on privacy and security.
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2. kardos ◴[08 Apr 25 16:58 UTC] No.43623924[source]▶
Indeed. KYC has a purpose though -- prevention of fraud, money laundering, etc. Getting rid of KYC without a similarly-effective solution for those things seems unlikely. Ideas?
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3. mndgs ◴[08 Apr 25 18:26 UTC] No.43624948[source]▶
Won't happen. Ever. Or concede to money laundering.
4. throttlebody ◴[08 Apr 25 21:53 UTC] No.43626848[source]▶
Are there any reasons we can't have both KYC and privacy/security ?
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5. amrocha ◴[09 Apr 25 01:09 UTC] No.43627979[source]▶
Here’s an idea, get rid of cryptocurrencies and the need for KYC basically vanishes.
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6. sneak ◴[09 Apr 25 05:25 UTC] No.43629132{3}[source]▶
If you get rid of cocaine, the need for rehab centers also vanishes.

There is no way to “get rid of cryptocurrencies” at this point save for shutting off the internet. It is not within the power of the state to prohibit, any more than prostitution or cocaine.

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7. amrocha ◴[09 Apr 25 09:17 UTC] No.43630298{4}[source]▶
Sure, there would be a black market for it, but that black market would be a lot smaller than the open market we have right now.

There’s plenty of legal ways of exchanging cryptocurrencies for real currencies, shutting those down would be a good start.

8. karn97 ◴[09 Apr 25 11:55 UTC] No.43631113[source]▶
Is this a real question?
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9. irusensei ◴[09 Apr 25 13:23 UTC] No.43631784[source]▶
That’s not really true. Most financial crimes are big operations facilitated by banks. Criminals love KYC because that’s a chance to make their operations seem legit.
10. hakfoo ◴[12 Apr 25 05:24 UTC] No.43661580{3}[source]▶
I could see some sort of certificate driven approach.

Customers and merchants generate a keypair and CSR. The CSR by design contains no personal information. You submit the public key/CSR and seperate identifying information to a KYC authority.

The government generates a signed certificate the bank can use to open an account, and the customer or merchant signs their transaction requests using their private key to associate them with the account.

The bank has a paper trail showing KYC was performed, but does not have any personal information about the participants, almost akin to the old "numbered Swiss account" cliche.

Ideally, the KYC authority deletes the personal data after issuing certificates, but I'd expect it would be more "information can be released under court order" or "revocation policy blah blah blah".

That's the level of tradeoff I'd expect is politically viable. Bank of America doesn't know you're buying hentai, but if it turns out the 1000-year-old character is actually 12, a court can lift the veil.