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177 points belter | 16 comments | | HN request time: 0.818s | source | bottom
1. lm28469 ◴[] No.43623434[source]
Daily reminder that fossils aren't decreasing and renewables are just added on top.

The only recent time fossil decreased was during covid, and even then it barely was a dent. To meet our climate goals we'd need something in the same vein as covid... constantly

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/energy-consumption-by-sou...

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2. sightbroke ◴[] No.43623507[source]
Article is limited on numbers perhaps but does state:

> Phil MacDonald, Ember's managing director, said: "Paired with battery storage, solar is set to be an unstoppable force.

"As the fastest-growing and largest source of new electricity, it is critical in meeting the world's ever-increasing demand for electricity."

> Despite the rise in renewable power, electricity from more polluting fossil fuels crept up by 1.4% last year due to surging demand, meaning emissions from the sector rose too to an all-time high.

> Ember forecasts the growth in clean power will soon outpace the growth in demand, helping to displace fossil fuels from the system.

Is fossil fuel use growing at an increasing rate or decreasing rate? Is non-carbon emitting energy supplies growing at an increasing rate or decreasing?

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3. lm28469 ◴[] No.43623569[source]
None of them are decreasing globally, that's the point
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4. sightbroke ◴[] No.43623614{3}[source]
If fossil fuels are growing at a decreasing rate that means that eventually they will stop growing. That's the point.
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5. bryanlarsen ◴[] No.43623688[source]
Per capita fossil fuel consumption has been dropping for ~10 years. 2025 will be the year where total CO2 emissions drop and continue to drop. They were hoping that 2024 would be that year, but 2024 GDP growth was higher than expected. The 2025 trump-cession guarantees that CO2 emissions will drop in 2025.

https://climateanalytics.org/comment/will-2024-be-the-year-e...

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6. lm28469 ◴[] No.43623734{4}[source]
Does this look like it's coming to a plateau of even a slowdown to you ? https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/fossil-fuel-consumption-b...

> To keep global warming to no more than 1.5°C – as called for in the Paris Agreement – emissions need to be reduced by 45% by 2030 and reach net zero by 2050.

Even if we stopped right now we'd need to be back to ~2000 co2 emissions by 2030, that's in 5 years. Even if we had 5 years of covid with the same restrictions as we had in peak 2020 we wouldn't reach that point...

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7. sightbroke ◴[] No.43623751[source]
> The 2025 trump-cession guarantees that CO2 emissions will drop in 2025.

I do not want to start a whole political tirade so the following is meant more as humor:

Wouldn't that be ironic. Trump's actions help curb global climate change and bankrupts billionaires.

8. lm28469 ◴[] No.43623838[source]
> Per capita

I have another question then, does the planet care about "per capita" or about "total" emissions ?

Every few years they come up with the same fucking graph were the solid line goes straight up until "now" and the dotted line magically decreases in the close future and reach 0 in 50+ years, when none of us will be alive and accountable. meanwhile: https://climatanthropocene.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/12/co...

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9. sightbroke ◴[] No.43623962{5}[source]
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/global-energy-substitutio...

If you look at which is growing faster you see that renewables appear to be growing faster relative to fossil fuels.

10. kstrauser ◴[] No.43624266{3}[source]
> I have another question then, does the planet care about "per capita" or about "total" emissions ?

Assuming the number of humans don't drastically change from year to year, those are roughly proportional.

If per capita emissions drop by 2% and the population increases by 1%, it's still a win.

11. slaw ◴[] No.43624372[source]
>The world's population is projected to continue growing for the next 50 to 60 years

https://www.un.org/en/global-issues/population

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12. perrygeo ◴[] No.43624993[source]
Thank you. At this point the renewable energy cheerleaders have resorted to greenwashing; we need voices of reason to hold us accountable.

The headline was clearly written to tell a story - that renewables are winning. According to what metric? If the goal is to reduce dependence of fossil-fueled carbon emissions (remember that pesky detail?) then renewables are evidently failing at their core objective. It's observable truth but a very uncomfortable one, as shown by the number of people downvoting - most would rather shift the goalpost than admit failure.

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13. zahlman ◴[] No.43625206{3}[source]
Sure. But that population estimate is only something like 25% higher than today's population; the per capita decline with improvements in technology could be much more dramatic than that. Plus, the remaining increase in population is likely to be biased towards poorer parts of the world where per capita consumption is already lower. Parts of the world that haven't had a fossil-fueled industrial revolution by now shouldn't ever be expected to - they'll be able to leap-frog over those technologies.
14. zahlman ◴[] No.43625274{5}[source]
It seems very unlikely that we'll make it to a 1.5°C target - but it now seems likely that we can get much closer to that than we were fearing around the time of the Paris Agreement being drafted. The planet seems very much set to survive, and in the longer run (on the scale of centuries) we can enable temperatures to come back down again - if we keep caring, and if we find that it would be optimal. (There is tons of room to restore tree cover.)
15. sightbroke ◴[] No.43625460[source]
The subheadline:

> Solar power has doubled in just three years, according to thinktank Ember, but rising electricity demand from air conditioning, AI and electric vehicles means electricity from fossil fuel sources still grew.

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16. perrygeo ◴[] No.43625611{3}[source]
Which is objectively a different statement than the headline - it heavily caveats the narrative stated in the headline yet still doesn't backpedal fast enough. It completely ignores the fact that electricity is only 20% of carbon emissions. We need massive amounts of energy for industrial processes that are nowhere near being electrified, even in concept let alone in practice at scale. It's looks distinctly like the data was cherry-picked and manipulated to highlight the easy wins we've accomplished already and to serve the "renewables are winning" narrative.

This is beyond burying the lede. This is an intentionally misleading headline. Holding ourselves accountable to the real goal (reducing CO2) is the only way to succeed - as soon as we start fudging the goalpost and claiming victory, we're no longer doing credible science communication.

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