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295 points mdhb | 3 comments | | HN request time: 0.625s | source
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lenerdenator ◴[] No.43561132[source]
Any time you read anything having to do with this administration, remember:

The behavior will continue until an effective negative stimulus is given.

Then immediately stop reading. The details don't matter at this point.

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jfengel ◴[] No.43561154[source]
It has to be a stimulus they feel as negative.

Losing office is about the only unarguable one. Barring a coup, that isn't happening any time soon.

Practically any other stimulus will be perceived as positive.

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mmooss ◴[] No.43561401[source]
High-aggression is a negotiating tactic with basic goals - to intimidate the other side into thinking you are implacable, and to make you seem unstoppable.

It's a tactic. Like everyone else, they have interests and goals and needs, and they can be deterred in the same way. The problem is, nobody really tries. The Democrats keep doing the same ineffective things - a demonstration of being cowed and intimidated.

For example, the Dems have almost no ability to communicate with the public. Whatever Trump and the GOP say are effectively true because there is no counter voice (beyond some third parties). The Dems don't do anything about it; they just keep communicating in the same way.

The Dems have no talking points. A few of them are organizing now around 'economic populism' - in other words, they are completely cowed and will avoid all the major threats to freedom, democracy, the rule of law, safety; the corruption, cruelty, and hate. They are going to their safe space - economic policy!

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jfengel ◴[] No.43561846[source]
I can't imagine what kind of talking points one needs to offer past "uh, we aren't criminals and we're not incompetent".

If the response is "yeah, we're good with those things, what else have you got?" I don't know what to say. You want bread? Maybe some circuses?

The Democrats did have plenty of policies. Realistic ones. Not the most exciting. If the public wants to be excited, and aren't picky about it, then indeed they should have that. But I'm not going to be able to provide it.

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tw04 ◴[] No.43562283[source]
No, the democrat's problem is they weren’t willing to just flat out lie. They told the public the truth, basic facts like no, the president doesn’t have the power to unilaterally lower your grocery prices. And whether due to desperation, or lack of education, or otherwise, the voting public chose the proven pathological liar who said he would be the one to lower the price of eggs. Right up until the week after the election when he had to explain why the prices weren’t going down.

There are countless interviews with voters quoting the laughable and provably impossible promises/lies Trump spouted during the last campaign as their reason for voting for him.

If what you’re advocating is that the democrats need to embrace denying reality and lying to the public if they want to win, I can’t disagree with you. But I also think historians won’t have a tough time pointing to the end of the American experiment.

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1. mmooss ◴[] No.43562677[source]
> They told the public the truth, basic facts like

Just telling people the 'truth' isn't effective communication at all (in fact, it can be dangerous) - that should be obvious to anyone with some experience in life. To tell the 'truth' and then throw up your hands because it didn't work is just being at victim.

A major political party knows all that - it's shameful and corrupt that they don't care to be effective.

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2. jfengel ◴[] No.43562862[source]
I know it takes more than telling the truth. It's that voters are seeking out obvious lies. That is where I throw up my hands.

I don't expect the voters to love boring truths. But if they actively want to be lied to, and revel in getting away with lies, then democracy is not the tool for me.

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3. ethbr1 ◴[] No.43564227[source]
If a politician tells an obvious lie, it's not enough to call it a lie.

There has to also be a competing vision.

The Democrats have been stuck in a "That's a lie!" + {crickets} rut for too long.

What is the competing vision? (And no, general platitudes about freedom, democracy, and apple pie aren't enough)