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927 points smallerfish | 17 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom
1. josu ◴[] No.42925559[source]
Here is the retained purchasing power of each of the coins since the law was passed in September 2021:

Legal tender 1: -15%

Legal tender 2: +115%

Guess which one has been deemed a "Failed experiment".

replies(4): >>42925649 #>>42925740 #>>42925991 #>>42933485 #
2. gameman144 ◴[] No.42925649[source]
I would guess "Legal tender 2" was deemed a failed experiment, since rapid deflation is extremely undesirable in a currency.
replies(1): >>42929067 #
3. sporkydistance ◴[] No.42925740[source]
If legal tender #2 went up 115% in 4 years I would feel like a jackass for spending it in 2021 because I would have doubled my money if I saved it.

Do you see the absurdity?

replies(2): >>42925935 #>>42931320 #
4. josu ◴[] No.42925935[source]
Inflationary legal tender is a novel concept.
replies(1): >>42926277 #
5. georgeecollins ◴[] No.42925991[source]
If the value of the dollar increased or stayed 100% stable we would be in a depression. In fact, the only time the dollar increased in value for long was the great depression.

The point of legal tender is that it reduces in value slowly over time, so you don't just hoard it under your bed. If someone paid me in BTC, I wouldn't spend it, I would hang on to it. That's not how currency works. Currency is the thing you want to spend, not hand on to.

replies(2): >>42927574 #>>42930673 #
6. bawolff ◴[] No.42926277{3}[source]
So novel... remind me again what happened to spain in the 16th century?
7. attila-lendvai ◴[] No.42927574[source]
hence the two words/concepts: currency and money.

and they both can share the same unit of account.

The Unadulterated Gold Standard articles have a more detailed discussion of this.

8. toenail ◴[] No.42929067[source]
> since rapid deflation is extremely undesirable in a currency

What do you mean, why should my money NOT go up in value?

replies(1): >>42929308 #
9. Unearned5161 ◴[] No.42929308{3}[source]
if you genuinely are interested in an answer to your question, I recommend this blog post by Matt Ranger:

https://singlelunch.com/2020/10/21/badeconomics-putting-400m...

replies(2): >>42929346 #>>42929537 #
10. toenail ◴[] No.42929346{4}[source]
That's a long post that seems to tell me it's bad for the economy. It's not my job to help the economy. Again, why should I use a money that loses value?
replies(1): >>42929446 #
11. Unearned5161 ◴[] No.42929446{5}[source]
That's an odd take. What's bad for the economy is, for the most part, bad for you.

But to answer your question more directly, you should use a money that loses value because its purpose is as a medium of exchange and not a store of value. You need to have something in your life that you can reliably use to acquire things you need and exchange them for things you have (new laptop for hours worked). You want a hot potato, you get it, you pass it along to someone else. If you don't want to spend it on material goods and want to save, that's fine, you can instead "buy" a savings, or "buy" an index fund. You're still passing the hot potato around, but its giving you different things.

Now imagine you don't have a hot potato, you work and you get paid in... idk, something you don't want to get rid of. You struggle with letting go with your currency and so it costs you when you're trying to do exchanges. Similarly, if you're a shop owner or something, people are more hesitant to give you their currency as well. Things get slower, and darker, like a mechanical flashlight that you're spinning slower and slower.

replies(1): >>42929545 #
12. ◴[] No.42929537{4}[source]
13. toenail ◴[] No.42929545{6}[source]
> But to answer your question more directly, you should use a money that loses value because its purpose is as a medium of exchange and not a store of value

That's an odd definition of money. The ancient Greeks already thought that money is medium of exchange AND a store of value, and throughout history people have preferred money that held its value. It's also circular reasoning. A medium of exchange should lose value, so you should use money that loses value.

> you can instead "buy" a savings, or "buy" an index fund

So money that loses value creates inefficiencies in the economy, because people have to waste time worrying about preserving their wealth, investing, etc.

> You struggle with letting go with your currency

I still need to eat, to live somewhere, I want to experience things, a money that increases in value does not destroy my desire to consume.

replies(1): >>42929860 #
14. Unearned5161 ◴[] No.42929860{7}[source]
=) you're conflating meanings, perhaps due to some of my handwaving. There's a difference between a medium of exchange that loses value, and a medium of exchange that LOSES value. People don't want the latter. That potato is too hot. You want something that loses a measured, controlled, amount of value over time. How much? About 3% per year seems to be a good number that people more educated than me tout around.

I'm also not sure that's a circular reasoning as I provide the reasons why you want a medium of exchange that loses value...

Hmmm... sure, I suppose you can look at it that way. In an inflationary-esque economy, you worry about saving your wealth, so you create instruments to do so: fractional reserve banking, mutual funds, etc. This is a problem with many solutions. On the other hand, in a deflationary-esque economy, you worry about spending your wealth, and perhaps more importantly, getting everyone around you to spend it as well. That problem has less solutions.

I said you struggle, you don't hold on forever, you struggle letting go. As in you eventually do let go, but not as quickly as if it had been depreciating. It functions as a brake on consumption, not a full stop. It slows things down. Slow is not good. Things start to go down when things slow.

15. aucisson_masque ◴[] No.42930673[source]
> I wouldn't spend it, I would hang on to it.

Well the point of money is to use it at some point, your theory is right if people were to live for the infinity but we don't so at some point you will spend all your hard earned Bitcoin because you just don't want to die rich but live rich.

That's the basic reason why all this nonsense about how bad having an deflationary economy is crap. People spend at some point their money, they don't hold on to it for ever.

At some point a balance between reward (money taking more value) and loss (time spent starving, not benefiting from your assets) is reached.

16. Palmik ◴[] No.42931320[source]
Can you expand on the argument? You might as well have invested the 2021 "value" (regardless of in which currency it was disbursed) into some non-inflationary asset (like bitcoin, gold or some index fund) -- that should make you feel equally bad.
17. mkipper ◴[] No.42933485[source]
And if you wrote this comment in December 2022, Bitcoin would be sitting at -70%.

I sincerely don't know anything about monetary policy, but I can't imagine that sort of volatility in the value of your currency is considered a good thing.