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612 points dayanruben | 5 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source
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uhura ◴[] No.42901158[source]
I believe that this long game of Swift being "good for everything" but "better for Apple platforms" will be detrimental to the language. This does not help the language nor seems to bring more people to the ecosystem.

Competitors seems to have a combination of: - Being more open-source - Have more contributors - Have a narrower scope

Maybe they should consider open sourcing all the tooling (like Xcode) otherwise the gap will only grow over time when compared to other languages.

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JTyQZSnP3cQGa8B ◴[] No.42901558[source]
This has been my experience for a long time. Swift is nice but why would I waste my time working on a language that is too tied to the Apple platform even if it's open-source when we have more universal scripting languages like Python, or languages like Kotlin that are compiled but have more support (because I trust JetBrains way more than Apple at the moment), or languages that are most strict like Rust but have more momentum and safety?

They painted themselves in a corner. Apple being the best computing platform while trying to please everyone can never be a serious proposition. Either they are the best and everyone uses macOS, or we have to be so careful that any alternative is more interesting that what they propose.

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thih9 ◴[] No.42901756[source]
> why would I waste my time working on a language that is too tied to the Apple platform

This might work the other way round: starting from people familiar with macos or ios development who want to write for other platforms.

Then the question becomes: why would a developer learn a different open source language when they can use what they already know. And sure, depending on the context they might still go with Python/Kotlin/Rust/etc.

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1. hu3 ◴[] No.42903096{3}[source]
> people familiar with macos or ios development who want to write for other platforms.

This is a rather small userbase when it comes to enterprise.

Especially because Swift will never be as versatile as Python or as efficient as Rust.

And then there's also Go, C# and Kotlin with much better tooling.

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2. privacyis1mp ◴[] No.42903527[source]
Xcode gives me such a hard time that I started considering writing in Kotlin for macOS, just to have a normal IDE. We used to have AppCode (from JetBrains) and it was great. I wonder why Apple didn't support JetBrains, after all, it would have been to Apple's benefit.
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3. ChrisMarshallNY ◴[] No.42905182[source]
Personally, I never liked AppCode. It was too much like Eclipse (which I also never liked).

Me not liking something, does not make it bad. It’s just not my choice. I’m glad it existed, because it probably prompted Apple to do better with Xcode. Lots of people that I respect, used it.

These days, Xcode is Big Bug Ranch. When “Delete the DerivedData folder” is S. O. P. for developers, and Apple tweaked Xcode to reduce its impact on the project, you know that they have waved a white flag to bugs.

4. joseda-hg ◴[] No.42905358[source]
There's even history of it working before, with Google / Kotlin
5. pjmlp ◴[] No.42906666[source]
Since Apple has moved themselves out of the server market, folks need to at least be able to target BSD/Linux server workloads, and naturally using Swift as well instead of another language is a desired option.