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695 points crescit_eundo | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0.203s | source
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codeflo ◴[] No.42145710[source]
At this point, we have to assume anything that becomes a published benchmark is specifically targeted during training. That's not something specific to LLMs or OpenAI. Compiler companies have done the same thing for decades, specifically detecting common benchmark programs and inserting hand-crafted optimizations. Similarly, the shader compilers in GPU drivers have special cases for common games and benchmarks.
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darkerside ◴[] No.42146244[source]
VW got in a lot of trouble for this
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sigmoid10 ◴[] No.42146560[source]
Apples and oranges. VW actually cheated on regulatory testing to bypass legal requirements. So to be comparable, the government would first need to pass laws where e.g. only compilers that pass a certain benchmark are allowed to be used for purchasable products and then the developers would need to manipulate behaviour during those benchmarks.
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0xFF0123 ◴[] No.42146749[source]
The only difference is the legality. From an integrity point of view it's basically the same
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Thorrez ◴[] No.42146884[source]
I think breaking a law is more unethical than not breaking a law.

Also, legality isn't the only difference in the VW case. With VW, they had a "good emissions" mode. They enabled the good emissions mode during the test, but disabled it during regular driving. It would have worked during regular driving, but they disabled it during regular driving. With compilers, there's no "good performance" mode that would work during regular usage that they're disabling during regular usage.

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Lalabadie ◴[] No.42146959[source]
> I think breaking a law is more unethical than not breaking a law.

It sounds like a mismatch of definition, but I doubt you're ambivalent about a behavior right until the moment it becomes illegal, after which you think it unethical. Law is the codification and enforcement of a social contract, not the creation of it.

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Thorrez ◴[] No.42147314[source]
>I doubt you're ambivalent about a behavior right until the moment it becomes illegal, after which you think it unethical.

There are many cases where I think that. Examples:

* Underage drinking. If it's legal for someone to drink, I think it's in general ethical. If it's illegal, I think it's in general unethical.

* Tax avoidance strategies. If the IRS says a strategy is allowed, I think it's ethical. If the IRS says a strategy is not allowed, I think it's unethical.

* Right on red. If the government says right on red is allowed, I think it's ethical. If the government (e.g. NYC) says right on red is not allowed, I think it's unethical.

The VW case was emissions regulations. I think they have an ethical obligation to obey emissions regulations. In the absence of regulations, it's not an obvious ethical problem to prioritize fuel efficiency instead of emissions (that's I believe what VW was doing).

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banannaise ◴[] No.42148734[source]
Outsourcing your morality to politicians past and present is not a particularly useful framework.
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anonymouskimmer ◴[] No.42150043[source]
Ethics are only morality if you spend your entire time in human social contexts. Otherwise morality is a bit larger, and ethics are a special case of group recognized good and bad behaviors.
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1. chefandy ◴[] No.42216441[source]
I don't think "ethics" implies group recognition, though-- I'd call those principles mores.