←back to thread

628 points napolux | 2 comments | | HN request time: 0.454s | source
Show context
mxfh ◴[] No.42195789[source]
Since Know Your Meme doesn't give the reference for why it's a lake, maybe not everybody is familiar with british lore:

The mythical Lady of the Lake:

Probably best known via Monthy Python:

Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

In short: She teaches Lancelot arts and writing, infusing him with wisdom and courage, and overseeing his training to become an unsurpassed warrior.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lady_of_the_Lake

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EnigmaticEmpower...

replies(6): >>42196519 #>>42196534 #>>42197574 #>>42197985 #>>42201196 #>>42204781 #
mrandish ◴[] No.42196519[source]
This reminds me that Monty Python and the Holy Grail contributed actual historical knowledge about Arthurian legends to my knowledge base while growing up. Other examples of Python unintentional education include knowing the names of a myriad of obscure cheeses (the cheese shop skit), a shocking number of anachronistic synonyms for death (the parrot skit) and notable contributions of the Roman Empire (Life of Brian 'What have the Romans ever done for us?' skit).

While it didn't contribute to my GPA at the time, I'm sure I could name more notable philosophers than any other 8th grader in my school (philosopher's song skit). However, in high school it did spark the interest to look up and read about each of the philosophers in the song.

replies(3): >>42197622 #>>42203878 #>>42222298 #
graemep ◴[] No.42197622[source]
The problem is that comedy is frequently not factually accurate.

Roman Imperial contributions? Was Roman wine better than pre-Roman wine in that region? Did they improve sanitation, irrigation, medicine etc.? Rome was an oppressive slavery based society.

Then what about the Spanish Inquisition sketch? It keeps repeating "fanatically devoted to the Pope"" The Spanish inquisition was an arm of the Spanish monarchy, at least two Popes tried to shut it down, and some historians have suggested one of its aims was to reduce the power of the Papacy.

I do like the Philosopher's Song, the Dead Parrot and Cheese Shop.

Other comedies are no better. Black Adder has a witchfinder (an early modorn innovation) in a Medieval setting.

Pop culture is not historically accurate!

replies(6): >>42197874 #>>42198101 #>>42198580 #>>42198841 #>>42199176 #>>42202006 #
inglor_cz ◴[] No.42198580[source]
In a pre-industrial agricultural society, slavery or something similar (serfdom etc.) tends to be widespread, as human and animal muscles are the only reliable and ubiquitous source of energy. Humanity only really started getting rid of unfree backbreaking work by adopting steam engines. 300-400 years ago, most of us forists here would be unfree people working the fields in unfavorable conditions, with maybe 5 per cent being burghers and 1 per cent nobility.
replies(3): >>42198920 #>>42202775 #>>42212661 #
graemep ◴[] No.42202775[source]
> slavery or something similar (serfdom etc.)

Serfdom is very different from slavery. Even slavery is not always as bad as Roman slavery.

Roman slaves could be legally killed, tortured and raped (even children). Serfs might not have fair access to the law but at least in theory they had recourse and society recognised mistreating them was immoral.

Serfs could (meaningfully) marry. They were tied to the land so could not be separated from their families and sold elsewhere.

replies(1): >>42202882 #
1. inglor_cz ◴[] No.42202882[source]
"Serfdom is very different from slavery."

And Mac is very different from a PC, but they are still personal computers that pack some computing power...

My wider point was about unfree labor in pre-industrial conditions. There were many serf uprisings in Central Europe, which indicates that being a serf was sometimes very hard to bear.

We are so used to free labor nowadays that we can't really imagine a world where the vast majority of the population is physically subjugated to some lords.

replies(1): >>42203363 #
2. graemep ◴[] No.42203363[source]
My point is that Roman slavery was a lot more brutal than what was required by the lack of technology.

I beeeive (I cannot find hard data, although things like the Doomsday book should have recorded some snapshots of it) while there was a large serf population, it was not the "vast majority" as there were also lots of free peasants.

Yes, it was a hard life, but far better than their equivalents would have suffered under Roman rule.