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178 points rawgabbit | 6 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source | bottom
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infotainment ◴[] No.42169771[source]
> "I can't quit the job. If I say I'm going to quit, I'll be threatened that I will have to pay damages for quitting."

Interestingly, this is actually possible under Japanese law/legal precedent. If an employee, for example, decides to put in notice and then half-ass their job until their departure date, a company could actually sue the employee and win.

Other Japan-labor-law fun fact: if you are a contract worker, it is literally illegal for you to quit prior to your contract expiry date. Hope you like that job you signed onto!

Obligatory disclaimer: IANAL

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jandrewrogers ◴[] No.42169851[source]
The majority of developed countries have subtle versions of this. I was naive about this before I worked outside the US and saw the practical impact. The chains go both ways and have real downsides.

Having seen the perverse incentives this creates and the various ways in which it can be abused, I have come to the conclusion that the American “at-will” employment model is actually a good thing and benefits workers. No one should discount the value of having the power to tell your employer to fuck off at a moment’s notice with no practical repercussions. No one should be required to stay in an abusive relationship a moment longer than they wish to.

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croes ◴[] No.42169916[source]
I wouldn’t call losing your source of income and maybe your health insurance no practical repercussions.

I don’t know in which countries you worked but I didn’t have any problems getting out of a contract.

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jayd16 ◴[] No.42169939[source]
Inexplicably linking employment with healthcare seems unrelated to at-will employment.
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specproc ◴[] No.42170299[source]
I can spell it out, if it helps. In a country with exorbitant healthcare costs, it means that leaving your job means that you (and often your family) don't get healthcare.
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teaearlgraycold ◴[] No.42170364[source]
COBRA?
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rqtwteye ◴[] No.42170399[source]
That’s super expensive. ACA is often better but that may change now with the republicans having control of congress.
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vkou ◴[] No.42170525[source]
> That’s super expensive

COBRA costs you exactly how much you + your employer were paying for that insurance.

It's expensive because your employer's share of insurance was a significant part of your compensation (And because US healthcare costs are pants-on-head insane.) I'll point out that it's generally quite expensive to, like, stop getting paid.

Practically, post-ACA, health insurance in the US is about as tied to employment as having a roof over your head and food on your table is. If you don't have employment, or money, you're going to be in trouble - but that's the case with everything you need to live, not just healthcare.

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1. ponow ◴[] No.42170957[source]
Our regulations (including the medical guild) and legal structure (including crazy malpractice payouts for unintentional mistakes) forces everything to be more expensive than necessary. We are very far from a free market, even if we stopped with the untaxed benefits.
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2. rqtwteye ◴[] No.42171178[source]
US healthcare is a market but not for patients. Insurance, employers and hospitals negotiate a lot. But people who get employer based insurance just have to accept what they are given. Pretty crazy.
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3. naveen99 ◴[] No.42171793[source]
Don’t most large employers essentially self insure? They only outsource the administration to insurance companies, not the float.
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4. BlueTemplar ◴[] No.42172742[source]
Aren't healthcare costs in line with the very high US income levels (with people spending a high fraction of their income in it, because they can afford to), and the main issue is inequality (including lack of real insurance)?
5. consteval ◴[] No.42174058[source]
We left the free market of healthcare behind because it was awful for consumers. People who were disabled or otherwise had chronic conditions were, more or less, completely screwed. Not to mention these regulations are very much necessary. We want educated and highly certified doctors cutting you up.
6. rqtwteye ◴[] No.42181403{3}[source]
Sure. The point is that the employer does all the selecting of options and the patient/employer has to take what the employer chose. No market for the patient.