←back to thread

How Japanese black companies oppress workers (2014)

(www.tofugu.com)
178 points rawgabbit | 8 comments | 18 Nov 24 04:02 UTC | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom
Show context
infotainment ◴[18 Nov 24 04:44 UTC] No.42169771[source]▶
> "I can't quit the job. If I say I'm going to quit, I'll be threatened that I will have to pay damages for quitting."

Interestingly, this is actually possible under Japanese law/legal precedent. If an employee, for example, decides to put in notice and then half-ass their job until their departure date, a company could actually sue the employee and win.

Other Japan-labor-law fun fact: if you are a contract worker, it is literally illegal for you to quit prior to your contract expiry date. Hope you like that job you signed onto!

Obligatory disclaimer: IANAL

replies(10): >>42169791 #>>42169816 #>>42169829 #>>42169851 #>>42169890 #>>42169984 #>>42170138 #>>42170924 #>>42171672 #>>42172099 #
jandrewrogers ◴[18 Nov 24 05:04 UTC] No.42169851[source]▶
The majority of developed countries have subtle versions of this. I was naive about this before I worked outside the US and saw the practical impact. The chains go both ways and have real downsides.

Having seen the perverse incentives this creates and the various ways in which it can be abused, I have come to the conclusion that the American “at-will” employment model is actually a good thing and benefits workers. No one should discount the value of having the power to tell your employer to fuck off at a moment’s notice with no practical repercussions. No one should be required to stay in an abusive relationship a moment longer than they wish to.

replies(12): >>42169861 #>>42169916 #>>42169958 #>>42169989 #>>42170221 #>>42170290 #>>42170379 #>>42170469 #>>42170570 #>>42170636 #>>42170815 #>>42172640 #
1. CalRobert ◴[18 Nov 24 07:49 UTC] No.42170570[source]▶
I was stunned when I realised my Irish work contracts had a forced notice period, not just a courtesy. Accenture uses this as a tool to stop people quitting - forced three month notice even for super low level employees. Makes it hard to interview for new jobs!
replies(3): >>42170611 #>>42170677 #>>42171101 #
2. politelemon ◴[18 Nov 24 07:57 UTC] No.42170611[source]▶
It does not. New jobs know about notice periods and plan ahead.
replies(4): >>42170773 #>>42171156 #>>42171299 #>>42171327 #
3. lb1lf ◴[18 Nov 24 08:16 UTC] No.42170677[source]▶
Not at all, the labour market takes that into account, to the extent that if you're available to start working tomorrow, everyone is jostled off balance and chances are you will be asked to begin in three months, anyway.
4. Hamuko ◴[18 Nov 24 08:42 UTC] No.42170773[source]▶
I don’t think I’ve ever talked with a recruiter who didn’t ask what my notice period was in the opening conversation. IT services sector has a standard notice period too, so I think most employers expect 2-4 weeks anyways for most people they’d hire.
5. JackFr ◴[18 Nov 24 09:59 UTC] No.42171101[source]▶
I knew about such periods from reading the handbook when I was working for a global company where US was 3-4 weeks depending on title and other locations were ~3 months.

From a practical perspective, how does that work? I understand if you’re making widgets on the assembly line, you’re gonna keep coming in. But if you’re doing creative work or close work with customers, isn’t there a concern that you’re effort will definitely flag and you’re gonna do crappy work?

6. CalRobert ◴[18 Nov 24 10:10 UTC] No.42171156[source]▶
My wife’s experience was that having a three month notice period to change jobs was a dealbreaker. She’s not a software engineer.
7. harry_ord ◴[18 Nov 24 10:49 UTC] No.42171299[source]▶
Long ones can be a deal breaker though. It was for me when I was looking for a new job before. It's similar to being willing to relocate imo.
8. rsynnott ◴[18 Nov 24 10:55 UTC] No.42171327[source]▶
Three months is definitely very much on the high side.