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How Japanese black companies oppress workers (2014)

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178 points rawgabbit | 4 comments | 18 Nov 24 04:02 UTC | HN request time: 0.002s | source
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infotainment ◴[18 Nov 24 04:44 UTC] No.42169771[source]▶
> "I can't quit the job. If I say I'm going to quit, I'll be threatened that I will have to pay damages for quitting."

Interestingly, this is actually possible under Japanese law/legal precedent. If an employee, for example, decides to put in notice and then half-ass their job until their departure date, a company could actually sue the employee and win.

Other Japan-labor-law fun fact: if you are a contract worker, it is literally illegal for you to quit prior to your contract expiry date. Hope you like that job you signed onto!

Obligatory disclaimer: IANAL

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jandrewrogers ◴[18 Nov 24 05:04 UTC] No.42169851[source]▶
The majority of developed countries have subtle versions of this. I was naive about this before I worked outside the US and saw the practical impact. The chains go both ways and have real downsides.

Having seen the perverse incentives this creates and the various ways in which it can be abused, I have come to the conclusion that the American “at-will” employment model is actually a good thing and benefits workers. No one should discount the value of having the power to tell your employer to fuck off at a moment’s notice with no practical repercussions. No one should be required to stay in an abusive relationship a moment longer than they wish to.

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Iulioh ◴[18 Nov 24 06:25 UTC] No.42170221[source]▶
I think your opinion is influenced by probability being a well off professional in a field where you can easily find another job, maybe phisical location is not even that important.

Just an hypothesis.

I prefer the "chains on both sides" approach for the society.

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1. jandrewrogers ◴[18 Nov 24 06:40 UTC] No.42170292{3}[source]▶
Some of my dearest friends are on the lower end of working class and don’t make a lot of money. They worry about many things but finding another job is not among them. We talk about it. I am financially well off now but I’ve also lived decades of abject poverty, I am not unfamiliar with what that entails.

At every point in time, finding a job wasn’t an issue. It might have not been a great job, but it was a job that paid the bills until a better job came along. Being able to bootstrap to a better job is something the US does really well.

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2. Tade0 ◴[18 Nov 24 07:17 UTC] No.42170446[source]▶
That's a general feature of minimum-wage jobs, not just in the US. The reason is twofold:

-Huge staff rotation (a lot of it people getting fired).

-There being little consequences if a role isn't filled.

Regarding that second point: what happens if there's one cashier, delivery driver or store stocker fewer? Not much, except for delays, unless they're the very last one.

3. thirdacc ◴[18 Nov 24 10:30 UTC] No.42171224[source]▶
It can be a totally different experience if you have a chronic illness that affects your schedule, or if you don't have a car. In my case it's been both. Currently, lack of reliable transportation and a driver's license is the main issue.

I've been struggling to even get an interview in junior software dev for over a year now. Tried some help desk as well and never heard back. I've had my resume looked at quite a few times now, so I doubt that that's the problem.

If you go to r/jobs and related subreddits, there are plenty of people who are losing their minds after applying to thousands of jobs for the last 2 years without even getting a prescreen. Some are even being rejected by temp agencies. I assume that this is an anomaly and 2023-24 had a uniquely terrible job market.

I'm going to a job fair soon. Wish me luck.

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4. alsetmusic ◴[20 Nov 24 01:36 UTC] No.42190003[source]▶
> if you don't have a car.

I had a long gap between employers where I lived off of saved money and explored new tech with a hope that I'd be able to improve my standing in the market. It made it nearly impossible to get anyone interested in my application because the gap was years.

Once I'd finally changed that by working a temp gig (having now achieved recent employment), I started getting calls. The job I took required visiting clients on-site from time to time. They didn't think to ask me if I had a car or license. When they found out (as I took a company-paid Uber 25m in my second month), I sensed that they realized they'd left a huge gap in their interview process. I was reassigned to only visit clients that I could get to via a combination of train and ride-share or short ride-share.

Had they asked about long-distance on-sites and my ability to get there myself, I'm confident I wouldn't have been hired.