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troad ◴[] No.42161064[source]
I think it's telling that whenever someone raises concerns about any element of Rust, no matter how constructively, they're always met with a wall of "you must not truly get the borrow checker," or "you're using Rust wrong," or "stop trying to write <C/C++/Java/etc> in Rust!", usually with zero evidence that that is in fact what is happening. There's never anything to improve on Rust, it's always user error / a skill issue. If there ever surfaces any audio of Linus Torvalds and Ken Thompson discussing the pros and cons of the borrow checker, I expect a sea of patronising anime avatars to show up, seeking to explain Rust's invention of the concept of ownership to them.

Rust is really nifty, but there are still (many) things that could be improved in Rust, and we'd all benefit from more competition in this space, including Rust! This is not a zero sum game.

Honestly, I also think many people just want a nice ML-like with a good packaging story, and just put up with the borrow checker to get friendly C-like syntax for the Option monad, sum types with exhaustive matching, etc. This is a use case that could very much benefit from a competitor with a more conventional memory model.

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1. dathinab ◴[] No.42162713[source]
> zero evidence

you mean except the original poster often implying exactly that in their articles or the personal experience of the commenter that nearly always whenever they ran into borrow checker problems it was due to exactly that reason

> There's never anything to improve on Rust, it's always user error / a skill issue.

RFCs get accepted and implemented nearly every week, like in any language there is always a lot to improve

the problem is that the complains of such articles are often less about aspects where you can improve things but more about "the borrow checker is bad" on a level of detail which if you consider the borrow checker a fundamental component basically is "rust is fundamentally bad"

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2. ramon156 ◴[] No.42163005[source]
Yes, and that's why the comments usually are in some sense "you don't use the BC right", because they don't want a BC. And that's fine, but you can't blame Rust for this