Most active commenters
  • foohoge(5)
  • seanmcdirmid(3)

←back to thread

PRC Targeting of Commercial Telecommunications Infrastructure

(www.fbi.gov)
286 points 2OEH8eoCRo0 | 14 comments | 14 Nov 24 00:59 UTC | HN request time: 0.001s | source | bottom
Show context
clwg ◴[14 Nov 24 02:45 UTC] No.42132630[source]▶
I was working with MISP[0], an open-source threat intelligence sharing platform, and came across a really interesting dataset from the Australian Strategic Policy Institute on China's technology research institutions[1]. I liked the data so much I built a quick cross-filter visualization on top of it to help explore it[2].

The data offers a fairly comprehensive and interesting perspective on China's research priorities and organization, I can't speak to the effectiveness of the programs themselves, but it does make me concerned that we are falling far behind in many areas, including cyber security.

[0] https://www.misp-project.org/

[1] https://raw.githubusercontent.com/MISP/misp-galaxy/refs/head...

[2] https://www.layer8.org/8541dd18-ff05-4720-aac7-1bd59d3921dd/

replies(5): >>42132801 #>>42133485 #>>42134891 #>>42137891 #>>42143837 #
acheong08 ◴[14 Nov 24 03:17 UTC] No.42132801[source]▶
> we are falling far behind in many areas, including cyber security

In terms of quantity and quality of talent, I don't think the western world would fall behind China, especially with their strict control of information. Most people there will have difficulty independently learning about cybersecurity.

The difference is that most talent is captured by the private sector with higher compensation or bounties. Meanwhile, China can very easily compel anyone they need into the government so the % utilization on outward attacks is probably higher.

replies(10): >>42132860 #>>42132946 #>>42133034 #>>42133113 #>>42133133 #>>42133189 #>>42133488 #>>42133564 #>>42133646 #>>42135370 #
seanmcdirmid ◴[14 Nov 24 06:16 UTC] No.42133564[source]▶
That doesn’t sound like China at all. Having worked in Beijing for 9 years, they pay techies fairly well, not USA FAANG well, but better than Japan, much of Europe, Korea, even Singapore. So there is a lot of private sector movement in these areas, not just government. Information is easily obtained, piracy rates are still very high so it’s not like anything is really locked down behind a paywall. There are plenty of hackers who are in it with a passion, not just for the money, much like you’d find in the states or anywhere in the developed world.
replies(1): >>42133653 #
1. wordofx ◴[14 Nov 24 06:37 UTC] No.42133653[source]▶
Hahahhahahah no way. Salaries in Japan, Korea, Singapore are WAY better than China.
replies(3): >>42133689 #>>42133743 #>>42133826 #
2. seanmcdirmid ◴[14 Nov 24 06:46 UTC] No.42133689[source]▶
Not in tech. There is a weird de-emphasis of programmers in countries that aren’t the USA or mainland china. So a programmer from Japan with some experience/skills can move to Beijing (yes, there were many Japanese expat SWEs when I was there) for a better salary.
replies(1): >>42133731 #
3. foohoge ◴[14 Nov 24 06:55 UTC] No.42133731[source]▶
What? I'm Japanese but I've never heard a story about changing jobs to Chinese company. I heard a lot of stories about changing jobs to GAFAM.

Could you tell me more about that?

replies(2): >>42133760 #>>42134190 #
4. baka367 ◴[14 Nov 24 06:59 UTC] No.42133743[source]▶
Better than avg(China) - sure.

Better than tier1(China), where most of the research happens - the salaries in China are easily beating Japan and significant portion of the EU "centers" on top of having significantly lower cost of living on most of the relevant dimensions.

replies(1): >>42133930 #
5. seanmcdirmid ◴[14 Nov 24 07:03 UTC] No.42133760{3}[source]▶
Microsoft paid more in Beijing than Tokyo while I was there, it turns out even experienced programmers in Tokyo don’t make $200k/year. Especially if you have a PhD or research in a hot field, you can get a pretty good job in richer Chinese cities. But an apartment is probably more expensive to rent in Beijing, and definitely in Shanghai, than it is in much of Tokyo, so there are trade offs.
replies(1): >>42133825 #
6. foohoge ◴[14 Nov 24 07:20 UTC] No.42133825{4}[source]▶
It's true that rents in Tokyo are expensive, but Kawasaki or Adachi, where the commute takes about 20 minutes, are cheap. I don't know about the salary, but I checked X or blog and it seems that some are work in the US headquarters, but none in Beijing.

Anyway, when are you there? It looks you are talking in 2010.

7. leeorz ◴[14 Nov 24 07:20 UTC] No.42133826[source]▶
If you consider the exchange rate, of course, salaries in China would be much lower. If considering purchasing power and cost of living, Chinese salaries would have a relatively high level of competitiveness.
replies(1): >>42134398 #
8. foohoge ◴[14 Nov 24 07:45 UTC] No.42133930[source]▶
As I said in another thread, you can live cheaply in Japan if you're about 20 minutes by train from Tokyo. In that thread, someone said that rent is expensive in Beijing and Shanghai. It looks similar.

Anyway, in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs. It sounds the cost of living in China is expensive.

replies(1): >>42134369 #
9. numpad0 ◴[14 Nov 24 08:32 UTC] No.42134190{3}[source]▶
I don't think it's that much of an outrageous claim, plenty of our fellow countrymen works at local regional branches and English wings of China-owned companies these days. It doesn't take much stretch from there to imagine some of them moving to near their HQ.

It's annoying that sometimes people thinks there has to be basic mutual intelligibility between Chinese and Japanese languages against the reality that there's none, but this is not about that at all. Chill.

replies(1): >>42134481 #
10. tw1984 ◴[14 Nov 24 09:08 UTC] No.42134369{3}[source]▶
> in China I heard that if you go to hospital in a different household registration, you have to pay the full medical costs.

When talking about paying such full medical costs, let me share some concrete numbers with you, all numbers are from tier 1 cities like Shanghai -

Chest CT scan is 170-200 RMB, or 25-30 USD MRI scan is 260-460 RMB, or 35-65 USD Ultrasound is 20-170 RMB, or 3-25 USD PET CT is 6500 RMB, or 900 USD

https://ybj.sh.gov.cn/cmsres/9b/9baabfec6f6c4e3fa03d6289f5e7...

Ambulance cost is shockingly low, 30 RMB per call plus 7 RMB per KM, that is 4 USD per call plus 1 USD per KM.

https://wx.sh120.sh.cn/mobjsp/helpinfo/FeeScale.jsp?communit...

when you can't afford those tests in the west or facing a stupidly long waiting period, don't be sad, just jump onto an airplane to get yourself checked & treated in Shanghai. You'd still save heap of money saved after such extra travel costs.

replies(1): >>42134419 #
11. wordofx ◴[14 Nov 24 09:15 UTC] No.42134398[source]▶
There are sooo many programmers in China that they don’t value programming. You get paid peanuts because there’s so many people to do the job.
12. foohoge ◴[14 Nov 24 09:18 UTC] No.42134419{4}[source]▶
Haha, it's more expensive than Japan. A frog in a well does not know the ocean.
replies(1): >>42134729 #
13. foohoge ◴[14 Nov 24 09:32 UTC] No.42134481{4}[source]▶
Is this response about a Chinese-owned company? They said about Microsoft in other responses and I don't receive like that.

I'm not good at English, so I don't get the nuances that native speakers do.

14. tw1984 ◴[14 Nov 24 10:15 UTC] No.42134729{5}[source]▶
there are also $1 houses in Japan, it is definitely leading in such affordability race.