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197 points LorenDB | 3 comments | | HN request time: 0s | source
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Spivak ◴[] No.41908420[source]
T-Mobile's filing is shorter than the article: https://www.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/1017178290200/1

> T-Mobile estimates that its prepaid customers, for example, would see subsidies reduced by 40% to 70% for both its lower and higher-end devices, such as the Moto G, Samsung A15, and iPhone 12.

This is such a confusing line, you're in control of that. Also if that were true this would be great for you. Don't you want to be making more money? But in practice can you not just enforce this by contract? You must make a 12 month commitment to T-Mobile to qualify for discounted phones.

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cwyers ◴[] No.41908485[source]
In the pre-paid market niche, you have people who really struggle to put together the money for an iPhone 12 all in one go, and T-Mobile has essentially worked to create a razors/blade model with some obfuscation. It's possible that disaggregating phone plans from installment pricing would benefit consumers in the long run, but let's not act like everybody would be prepared to transition to that world immediately. (I don't think T-Mobile is exactly concerned for their customers, but this subsidy regime exists for a reason.)
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1. Spivak ◴[] No.41908540[source]
That actually makes some sense and (I assume) you can let the service lapse and keep the phone if you don't have the money right now?

It seems in both cases T-Mobile is making a bet that you'll continue to use their service in one form or another. Is there a reason if it was unlocked you would immediately switch?

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2. jacobr1 ◴[] No.41908610[source]
>Is there a reason if it was unlocked you would immediately switch?

If there was a better price or promotional discount available from a competitor?

3. cwyers ◴[] No.41908634[source]
Yeah, you can let the service lapse and resume it, you just can't take the phone elsewhere. T-Mobile is taking on some risk there, to be sure.

As far as why you would immediately switch -- T-Mobile is not losing money on these phone subsidies in the aggregate (they are in some cases, to be sure). They're pricing the subsidies into their carrier rates. If this went through, they'd likely have to cut the subsidies and engage in pure competition on pre-paid mobile rates. I know some HN readers read that last line and go, "good," but the fact of the matter is that people who are buying subsidized phones on pre-paid plans are generally poor credit risks generally and phones lose a huge amount of their value the second you open the shrink-wrap so they're not very worthwhile as security for a secured loan, so by unbundling these two, T-Mobile starts to compete with everybody else on rates for service and somebody else steps in to handle the leases on phones, and if you look at that market segment, the answer in the US as to who is most prepared to take over that business, the answer is _Rent-A-Center_. The total cost to buy a PS5 Slim is $500, the total cost to get a PS5 Slim through my nearest Rent-A-Center is $1,349.50. Again, I am sure that T-Mobile is not advocating for this out of charity, but I'm not as convinced as some around here that this form of unbundling would be an unmitigated good thing.

EDIT: And to your point of, well wouldn't pre-paid operators all switch to a contract model, I don't think "you can't get phone service without a contract" is what people who are advocating for this reform want, and the primary customer for a pre-paid plan is someone who is too large a credit risk to get a 12-month contract through someone else. I said primary customer, if you want to tell me you're a great credit risk but you're on prepaid as an ideological stance, just pretend I already know that about you.