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US probes Tesla's Full Self-Driving software after fatal crash

(www.reuters.com)
410 points jjulius | 8 comments | 18 Oct 24 16:01 UTC | HN request time: 0.466s | source | bottom
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jqpabc123 ◴[18 Oct 24 12:19 UTC] No.41878712[source]▶
By now, most people have probably heard that Tesla's attempt at "Full Self Driving" is really anything but --- after a decade of promises. The vehicle owners manual spells this out.

As I understand it, the contentious issue is the fact that unlike most others, their attempt works mostly from visual feedback.

In low visibility situations, their FSD has limited feedback and is essentially driving blind.

It appears that Musk may be seeking a political solution to this technical problem.

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1. whamlastxmas ◴[18 Oct 24 14:02 UTC] No.41879568[source]▶
It’s really weird how much you comment about FSD being fake. My Tesla drives me 10+ miles daily and the only time I touch any controls is pulling in and out of my garage. Literally daily. I maybe disengage once every couple days just to be on the safe side in uncertain situations, it I’m sure it’d likely do fine there too.

FSD works. It drives itself fine 99.99% of the time. It is better than most human drivers. I don’t know how you keep claiming it doesn’t or doesn’t exist.

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2. jqpabc123 ◴[18 Oct 24 14:07 UTC] No.41879611[source]▶
So you agree with Musk, the main problem with FSD is political?

Tesla says on its website its "Full Self-Driving" software in on-road vehicles requires active driver supervision and does not make vehicles autonomous.

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/nhtsa-...

3. sottol ◴[18 Oct 24 14:08 UTC] No.41879614[source]▶
The claim was about _full_ driving being anything but, ie not _fully_ self-driving, not being completely fake. Disengaging every 10-110 miles is just not "full", it's partial.

And then the gp went into details in which specific situations fsd is especially problematic.

4. peutetre ◴[18 Oct 24 14:40 UTC] No.41879880[source]▶
The problem is Tesla and Musk have been lying about full self-driving for years. They have made specific claims of full autonomy with specific timelines and it's been a lie every time: https://motherfrunker.ca/fsd/

In 2016 a video purporting to show full self-driving with the driver there purely "for legal reasons" was staged and faked: https://www.reuters.com/technology/tesla-video-promoting-sel...

In 2016 Tesla said that "as of today, all Tesla vehicles produced in our factory – including Model 3 – will have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver." That was a lie: https://electrek.co/2024/08/24/tesla-deletes-its-blog-post-s...

Musk claimed there would be 1 million Tesla robotaxis on the road in 2020. That was a lie: https://www.thedrive.com/news/38129/elon-musk-promised-1-mil...

Tesla claimed Hardware 3 would be capable of full self-driving. When asked about Hardware 3 at Tesla's recent robotaxi event, Musk didn't want to "get nuanced". That's starting to look like fraud: https://electrek.co/2024/10/15/tesla-needs-to-come-clean-abo...

Had Tesla simply called it "driver assistance" that wouldn't be a lie. But they didn't do that. They doubled, tripled, quadrupled down on the claim that it is "full self-driving" making the car "an appreciating asset" that it would be "financially insane" not to buy:

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/04/23/elon-musk-any-other-car-than...

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/03/03/cars/musk-tesla-cars-valu...

It's not even bullshit artistry. It's just bullshit.

Lying is part of the company culture at Tesla. Musk keeps lying because the lies keep working.

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5. whamlastxmas ◴[18 Oct 24 17:55 UTC] No.41881832[source]▶
Most of this is extreme hyperbole and it’s really hard to believe this is a genuine good faith attempt at conversation instead of weird astroturfing, bc these tired inaccurate talking points are what come up in literally every single even remotely associated to Elon. It’s like there’s a dossier of talking points everyone is sharing

The car drives itself. This is literally undeniable. You can test it today for free. Yeah it doesn’t have the last 0.01% done yet and yeah that’s probably a lot of work. But commenting like the GP is exhausting and just not reflective of reality

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6. jqpabc123 ◴[18 Oct 24 18:27 UTC] No.41882109{3}[source]▶
... not reflective of reality

Kinda like repeated claims of "Full Self Driving" for over a decade.

7. peutetre ◴[18 Oct 24 21:49 UTC] No.41883818{3}[source]▶
> bc these tired inaccurate talking points are what come up in literally every single even remotely associated to Elon

You understand that the false claims, the inaccuracies, and the lies come from Elon, right? They're associated with him because he is the source of them.

They're only tired because he's been telling the same lie year after year.

8. dham ◴[20 Oct 24 22:04 UTC] No.41898860[source]▶
It's similar to when DHH said they were not bundling code in production and all the Javascript bros said "No you can't do that it won't work". DHH was like "yes but I'm doing it"

That's how it feels in FSD land right now. Everyone's saying FSD doesn't work and it'll never be here, but I'm literally using it every day lol.