←back to thread

201 points andsoitis | 1 comments | | HN request time: 0.001s | source
Show context
defrost ◴[] No.41854450[source]
For an interesting side piece:

    Curiously, however, for a system apparently stultified by the dead hand of government, Australia’s health system far outperforms the free market-based US healthcare system, which spends nearly twice as much per capita as Australia to deliver far worse outcomes — including Americans dying five years younger than us.
The shocking truth: Australia has a world-leading health system — because of governments

Source: https://www.crikey.com.au/2024/10/16/pubic-private-healthcar...

Bypass: https://clearthis.page/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.crikey.com.au%2F...

    Overall, we now have the fourth-highest life expectancy in the world.

   This is contrary to the narrative that pervades the media about our health system — one in which our “frontline” health workers heroically battle to overcome government neglect and inadequate spending, while the population is beset by various “epidemics” — obesity, alcohol, illicit drugs.

    In fact, Australian longevity is so remarkable that in August The Economist published a piece simply titled “Why do Australians live so long?”
Other references:

The Economist: https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2024/08/23/why-do-a...

AU Gov Report: Advances in measuring healthcare productivity https://www.pc.gov.au/research/completed/measuring-healthcar...

replies(14): >>41854605 #>>41854613 #>>41854799 #>>41855053 #>>41855120 #>>41855218 #>>41855732 #>>41856242 #>>41856326 #>>41857738 #>>41857930 #>>41857960 #>>41858153 #>>41876405 #
alwayslikethis ◴[] No.41854605[source]
> the free market-based US healthcare system

market, maybe, "free" market? I doubt it.

It's not a very free market when there is such a large power differential between the buyer and the seller. You can't exactly shop around for the ambulance or the hospital when you need it, nor can you realistically circumvent the artificially constrained supply [1] of doctors to get cheaper healthcare (unless you live next to the border).

When the alternative is a one-sided market like this, government becomes rather more appealing.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Medical_Association#R...

replies(7): >>41856252 #>>41856671 #>>41856804 #>>41857003 #>>41857443 #>>41858041 #>>41859036 #
drdec ◴[] No.41857443[source]
>>the free market-based US healthcare system

>market, maybe, "free" market? I doubt it.

The consumer of healthcare is doubly removed from the price of healthcare. This is the opposite of a free market.

The patient did not pay the doctor, the insurance company does. In most cases the patient does not pay for insurance their employer does.

So the normal pricing forces of a free market are removed.

Then we need to talk about certificate of need laws which restrict the supply...

replies(3): >>41857769 #>>41860822 #>>41860950 #
Spooky23 ◴[] No.41857769[source]
The free market aspect is the insurance marketplace.

If you’re poor, you’re fucked. If you’re old you’re ok. If you work for the government or certain companies, you have access to world class care. Everyone else is on a spectrum from high quality PPO to the shittiest Cigna plan.

replies(2): >>41858085 #>>41860734 #
pclmulqdq ◴[] No.41858085[source]
There is nothing free about the health insurance market. It is regulated to hell to the point where a common complaint of actuaries I know is that they are not allowed to price your health risk.
replies(2): >>41858675 #>>41861031 #
caseysoftware ◴[] No.41858675[source]
^ When the grossly overweight 60yo smoker pays the same amount as a health-conscious 30yo, we have a problem.
replies(4): >>41859026 #>>41861023 #>>41861383 #>>41862710 #
FirmwareBurner[dead post] ◴[] No.41859026[source]
[flagged]
caseysoftware ◴[] No.41859104{3}[source]
Maybe but I'm more concerned about a) easily demonstrable and measurable risks not being addressed and b) separating people from the consequences of their own choices.

Ignoring risk and consequences doesn't make them go away.

replies(2): >>41860461 #>>41861106 #
1. azinman2 ◴[] No.41860461{4}[source]
What about the 60 year old with autoimmune issues? That have expensive drugs but it wasn’t “their actions” that led to this?

The entire system only works if healthy 30 year olds are putting in somewhat similarly (it will be cheaper regardless). Insurance is based on the idea of spreading risk. Without it insurance cannot function.